Pros and cons of screw heads have been analysed, discussed, debated and argued over in production engineering circles for ever. That's why we have the assortment illustrated.
(markup comments not mine)

 

Yes so many different configurations it boggles the mind although I doubt the Square is actually the Robertson. To take the battery out of my Speedmaster I need Torx, hex and phillips plus because I lost one of the hex head and happened to have a slotted head machine screw I now need 4 different bits. LOL

 

Henry Ford realized the benifit of them when building his model T, it dramatically cut the production time but he refused to pay the royalty and all the other industrialists followed suit. Well the darn patent is finished, Get on with it manufacturers!!

Your plea is falling on deaf ears. Most of the manufacturers don't speak English.

 

Trim head screws for installing wood molding uses the Robertson type screw head. Same goes for other applications in woodworking(I'm a retired furnituremaker). Most screws used in European style hidden cabinet hinges use the JIL standard star head which has the flat bottom.

 

JIS are the best screwheads I find. They never slip.

 

But can you one hand them and they stay on the screwdriver in a horizontal position. If not I will see your Japanese Industrial Standard and raise you two Robertson.

 

No No No if your working on a Japanese vehicle use Japanese Industrial Standard screwdrivers/bits. Philips or pozi will mangle the fixings.

 

Slotted screws make my soul hurt. 0/10.

 

I have no problem with cross-point screw heads if using the proper cross-point driver that matches.

 

What an interesting concept using the correct tool for a specific job or fastener.
That's almost like taking responsibility for your actions...😱

K

 

We can't have that - Things might work out. 😮
Wrong tool for the wrong job! FOREVER!🙃😆

 

My all time favourite has to be using caliper as slag pick or pry bar. There's such beauty in destroying perfectly good measuring instrument in matter of seconds just because user is dummer than the tool.

 

The right tool for the job has always been true, is true, and will continue to be true despite not being considered by many.

Channel locks and adjustable wrenches will continue to be mainstays in too many tool boxes.

 

Unfortunately for my Suzuki, I learned about the JIS screws too late. I could not figure out why I stripped out so many "phillips" screws on that bike. Of course when the dealer assembled the bike. If they used a torque wrench at all, they must've gotten the Newton meters vs ft lbs mixed up. Some of that **** was sooo tight, it had to be intentional as if the employee was disgruntled and having a bad day. The bolt that held my battery holder in place was steel. Threaded into aluminum subframe. I had to use a frickin 1/2" drive breaker bar on it to loosen it up. I looked at the mangled threads on the steel bolt. Right away I was deciding to either ream out and tap the aluminum subframe and use a helicoil or do I ream out the hole and stick a nut behind it? I looked around the subframe to see what was involved in its removal (I knew a machinist I could take it to as a favor) And that was when I noticed the threads on that aluminum alloy were just fine. I got a new bolt from the dealer, as it had a funky shoulder and could not substitute it. And I was back on the road. I really lucked out on that one.

 

Unfortunately for my Suzuki, I learned about the JIS screws too late. I could not figure out why I stripped out so many "phillips" screws on that bike. Of course when the dealer assembled the bike. If they used a torque wrench at all, they must've gotten the Newton meters vs ft lbs mixed up. Some of that **** was sooo tight, it had to be intentional as if the employee was disgruntled and having a bad day. The bolt that held my battery holder in place was steel. Threaded into aluminum subframe. I had to use a frickin 1/2" drive breaker bar on it to loosen it up. I looked at the mangled threads on the steel bolt. Right away I was deciding to either ream out and tap the aluminum subframe and use a helicoil or do I ream out the hole and stick a nut behind it? I looked around the subframe to see what was involved in its removal (I knew a machinist I could take it to as a favor) And that was when I noticed the threads on that aluminum alloy were just fine. I got a new bolt from the dealer, as it had a funky shoulder and could not substitute it. And I was back on the road. I really lucked out on that one.

The JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) vs. Phillips aspect is so confusing, especially with the parallel existence of the very different Pozidriv, etc. (although I don't think I've seen them on vehicles. It seems JIS may have been superseded by DIN standards?

Phillips, JIS, and Pozidriv screwdrivers explained | BikeGremlin US

There are screwdrivers that don’t slip (come out, “cam-out”) when unscrewing a tight screw. How to tell those, what are the differences?

bike.bikegremlin.com

One day I must buy some premium DIN/JIS drivers as described in that article. It seems they should be best for Phillips or JIS/DIN. As it is, my JIS impact driver bits are mainly wrecked after an encounter with seized Honda car brake disc retaining screws (for which they were a perfect fit but not tough enough).

 

I got a set of JIS screwdrivers off ebay the other year. I wouldn't be without them now for working on modern bikes as even my Thaiumph Sprint I used to have appeared to be JIS heads. I think my Thai HD is too, but there's not many screws on that so I can't recall off the top of my head. Most things are allen or Torx.

 

JIS screws if you look very carefully there's a small dot punched into the top of the screw or it can be a tiny x mark... don't know if this is still the case but when I look round my old Honda car the screws are marked.

 

If you grind the tip off a phillips (or pozidrive, I forget which) screwdriver it'll fit a JIS pretty well too.

I've never bothered as the proper tools aren't expensive.

 

As above T bar screwdriver and 4 common JIS bits under £15 Euro Car Part

 

The right tool for the job, huh? That’s easier said than done when talking about Phillips Head screws. The problem is, all the sizes of drivers “seem” to fit every screw, except when talking about the extreme big’uns and littl’uns. Even after all these years, I can’t tell by looking which screwdriver really fits. And, when I grab one, the tip always seems to fit into the slots. I mean, think of Allen Wrenches. One size too big, won’t fit in. One size too small, the tool just spins around. If Phillips Heads were like that, we’d be much better off.

 

The problem is, all the sizes of drivers “seem” to fit every screw, except when talking about the extreme big’uns and littl’uns. Even after all these years, I can’t tell by looking which screwdriver really fits.

"Seem to fit" is the mark of an amateur. Tools fit or they don't.

Common Phillips screwdriver sizes are 0, 1,2,3 . Pozi Drive and JIS screwdrivers are similarly sized.

Telling the difference is not that difficult if you know what to look for.

Putting a #2 Phillips in a #2 JIS screw does not "feel" right and vice versa.

Often times a JIS screw is differentiated from a Phillips by a "dot" on the screw head near the "cross".
If one takes the time to look the difference is really obvious.

Knowing the difference is a skill nurtured by pros with the right tools.
As a pro you bugger up enough screws and have to remove them and you learn.

For a DIYer with a limited toolbox it is more challenging, BUT the RIGHT tool for the job s the ONLY tool for the job.

If you really want tool confusion then there's the SAE-Metric-Whitworth/British Standard.

 

I have turned a lot of JIS screws in my time and I have rarely seen the identifying dot.
I bought what they were using when I was working in Japan. Hozan brand JIS drivers. They at first feel kind of dainty to what most of us are accustomed to. The shaft is smaller in diameter than many named brands, but they are really good tools.

As for the comment ="BUT the RIGHT tool for the job is the ONLY tool for the job"
Anyone that has turned wrenches for any length of time, knows that does not Always apply. But a good point to try and practice.

 

I have turned a lot of JIS screws in my time and I have rarely seen the identifying dot.
I bought what they were using when I was working in Japan. Hozan brand JIS drivers. They at first feel kind of dainty to what most of us are accustomed to. The shaft is smaller in diameter than many named brands, but they are really good tools.

The "dot" was more prominent in the 70's on bikes from the BIG 4 then it seemed to disappear.

Hozan tools are first rate on a par with Snap-on Phillips screwdrivers.

 

Hozan on 2nd? Then Hozan on 1st?
I'm just too funny, I just kill myself.... 😆 🤣

 

I have witnessed people over the years who deserved to have their toolbox welded shut.

 

With them inside.

 

Come on. A butter knife works great for slotted screw heads.

 

To further muddy the waters, I used to work in a fastener company on the trade counter. People often complained that the driver bits we sold were garbage as they chewed out. Some stuff is mesured in "Rockwells " which is a mesurable degree of hardness and the theory is that the driver bit should be less rockwells than the fastener so you don't chew out the phillips head in the screw. Easier to use another driver bit than try to remove a chewed out screw. Unfortunately the manufacturer (China or India) don't know or don't care how many Rockwells their product is. Hope this has added some mud.

 

Helpiing a buddy the past few days restoring an old RR the subject of Robertson came up, he having travelled in US more then I have he said it is almost impossible to find a Robertson screwdriver so if one is going south bring a set to tighten or loosen screws.(if you happen to have a need) Someday they may make the rounds.

 

I believe I have never seen a Robertson screw in my life (if oil pan plugs of some Renaults don't count) and I have basically lived last 25 years in repair shops of different fields, so I'd say they are not that common in europe either.

 

Had a GF back in the day who had a few tools- a wooden clog for "banging and smashing", an aforementioned butter knife for "prying and screwing", and a piece of old window screen for "sanding and smoothing"...everything thing else got either duct tape or a Bic lighter. She couldn't cook, either...

 

That sounds really familiar, as my mom was just like that. There's still about 100 duct tape fixes at my summerhouse which was her place until she passed few years ago and I have properly fixed at least as many 😂

 

my lovely wife is partial to push pins and plastic tape as the universal solution to repairs.

if she had been aboard the titanic with enough of them when it hit that iceberg, it would never have sunk.

 

theyre very common in wood screw applications in america

 

Trim head screws.