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Discussion Starter #1
I might cause a bit of a stir posting this but here goes

I have been following the latest trend to knock Triumph on all things lately - prices are too high , quality slipping, too many recalls etc etc

And lots of people are comparing Triumphs to Royal Enfield 650. This motorcycle is better in all departments apparently.The best thing since 270 degree firing order:wink2:

I am, and always will be, of the belief that you get what you pay for, be that reputation,reliabilty,finish,quality,whatever

Triumph motorcycles are no more expensive than their direct competition sich as Ducati,BMW and KTM

The latest Royal Enfield 650 is a nice old fashioned 650, reminds me of my 1976 Bonneville. If this is what you want in a motorcycle go for it. Just please stop bagging Triumph as they make amazing motorcycles that are quality products

Just my 2c worth (which is not much granted)

Cheers :smile2:
 

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It’s all relative. I definitely don't thing paying $13600 for a Tiger XRX that has ZERO, I mean 0 front and almost 0 rear suspension adjustability, besides preload, and 2 piston calipers got me what I paid for...

You say price is similar to Ducati and BMW etc... what do you say about a 12K bike that CAN BE ALSO FOUND DISCOUNTED right upon release with IMU standard? That’s the Ninja1000, btw. If such thing exists, well, then you don’t get what you pay for on the rest....

Do you think a Daytona is worth the price? Track tools like the ZX10R SE and R1 go for cheaper than the insane 22k or about about tag of the new one. And the 15K tag of the old one was still crazy with the only “tech” on it being a slipper cutch, and for a 128hp 675 engine. Yes, very nice machine, but how can I justify the same price as a ZX10R LOADED with tech that sells for 13K new?
 

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Don't think comparing to what you can find in a Japanese bike is relevant for Triumph. The Japanese companies are so much larger in scale than Triumph. I did buy a leftover 2014 Ninja1000ABS for a discount of $3K. In fact, comparing to other makes and models, which of course is what riders and journalists do, is not the point in buying a bike. In my view. If you want a Triumph, then what they offer, trim and price is what you are willing to accept. I do agree that comparing Triumphs to RE is not a fair or even proper comparison. If you can't justify what Triumph offers and their price compared to another make and model, then you purchase the other brand. Triumph's sales volume is that of Ducati. Both small in comparison to BMW and KTM.

Buying a motorcycle comes down to passion, perception, needs and price. It's all good.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks Felony you put what i wanted to say so much better?

Cheers mate. Lets all just keep on riding no matter what bike we own:smile2:
 

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And lots of people are comparing Triumphs to Royal Enfield 650. This motorcycle is better in all departments apparently.The best thing since 270 degree firing order
You think the Triumph is worth almost twice the price of an Enfield Interceptor when both are technology challenged with wire wheels, tubes tires, twin shocks, short travel forks, scant dealer locations, and importers who seem to be their brand's worst enemies?

As much as I like my AC T100 I'd rather have spent under $6k for a Royal Enfield Interceptor because both might end up orphaned in the US in a few years with no resale value and hard to get parts for. Had I done that I'd have the $5k I wouldn't have spent extra to get a Triumph to put towards a new ride.

Ducati offers far more tech in their bikes than Triumph and a better dealer network right now and BMW dealer network, parts availability, resale value, and management is so far superior to Triumph it isn't even a comparison.

The motorcycle business is not the motorcycle business anymore and manufacturers clinging to the way motorcycle business was done are done or soon will be. Even HD is feeling the heat.
 

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Compared to an old AC Bonneville, you might have a point. The newer Triumph bikes are just far nicer than the RE(s) IMO, and there are more models and nicer accessories...albeit a bit expensive. I like what RE is doing though, it is nice to have choices and I wish them lots of success. I would love to see them put out a production model of their little race bike they made. As someone else said, bike purchases are down to passion and what ticks your emotional boxes. Trying to reduce it to some cost benefit analysis just doesn't work....at least for the reasons most of us choose motorcycles, as recreational and luxury expenditures. I don't care if a cheaper bike has all the goodies if it doesn't move me one bit. If that were the case, we would all be riding the same bikes.

OP has been watching too much Stuart Filingham on YT if I had to guess. He seems to have a hard on for Triumph Corp. or whatever, and his channel has become the RE channel...oh and the Motone channel lol. I like his channel, but he can be a bit much sometimes.
 

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I bought a Royal Enfield INT650 in September after a long wait and have enjoyed the short time the weather cooperated to ride it. Nice bike, enough power, nice handling and Harris did a great job on the frame. I have a 1996 Triumph Thunderbird as well and have ridden both modern versions of the Bonneville and wouldn’t say the RE is the equal to the Bonneville or even my Thunderbird. There are some concessions with the RE but I fully realized that going in yet a thoroughly fun bike to ride. My 2 cents:)
 

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Thanks Felony you put what i wanted to say so much better?

Cheers mate. Lets all just keep on riding no matter what bike we own<img src="http://www.triumphrat.net/images/TriumphRat_2015/smilies/tango_face_smile.png" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" class="inlineimg" />
Ok so the original post compared Triumph with RE but don’t compare Triimph with the big Japanese?

I’ll tell you what I compare. A 2017 brand new old stock CBR1000RR, a 17000 dollar bike, for 9.9K. And then you have the old model Daytona’s selling for 15K and no discounts ever. Who in their right mind would not get a bike fully loaded with goodies for 6 K less? As much as I love the Daytona, I never pulled the trigger. I did however on the CBR.

This post is what you get for the price. It is irrelevant to me the reasons why. I don’t care if Triumph is small or big, my pocket does not care. Read my comment above about my Tiger and tell me if you think the lack of those features on a 13.6K bike is acceptable to you.

A 200 HP zx10r SE for 20k with electronic suspension, IMU, marchessini wheels, piggy back forks, and an “inspired by moto2 Daytona” for 22K? I’ll pass.
 

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Ok so the original post compared Triumph with RE but don’t compare Triumph with the big Japanese?

I’ll tell you what I compare. A 2017 brand new old stock CBR1000RR, a 17000 dollar bike, for 9.9K. And then you have the old model Daytona’s selling for 15K and no discounts ever. Who in their right mind would not get a bike fully loaded with goodies for 6 K less? As much as I love the Daytona, I never pulled the trigger. I did however on the CBR.

This post is what you get for the price. It is irrelevant to me the reasons why. I don’t care if Triumph is small or big, my pocket does not care. Read my comment above about my Tiger and tell me if you think the lack of those features on a 13.6K bike is acceptable to you.

A 200 HP zx10r SE for 20k with electronic suspension, IMU, marchessini wheels, piggy back forks, and an “inspired by moto2 Daytona” for 22K? I’ll pass.
I hear you loud and clear Evangelos. The Japanese make damn good bikes at highly competitive prices, especially in the leftover and used market. In my case, I recently traded my '17 Speed Triple with only 4,000 miles on it for a 2015 Yamaha FJR1300 ES with only 6,600 miles on it. In addition to the traction control and ABS my Speed Triple had, the FJR also has electronically adjustable suspension, heated grips, large hard bags, and superior comfort/wind protection for touring. And man that FJR is fast! Sure the Speed Triple is still faster and handles a bit better but for me, I prioritized comfort higher than acceleration and handling.

I just never bonded with the late model Speed Triple like I did my two previous 2007 models and wanted a long range touring bike instead. Surprisingly, the 2015 FJR1300 ES retained more of its value than the 2017 Speed Triple did and was worth roughly $500 to $1,000 more than the Speed Triple according to NADA despite it being two model years older. However, the fellow I traded with was younger and loved how light and lithe the Speed Triple was so it was a good trade for both of us. Now I'll be looking for a Roulette Green 2007 Speed Triple which was the best Speed Triple I ever owned.
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Forgot to add, the boutique pricing of Triumph, and BMW, was also the reason of not even test riding a Speed Twin and going straight to my Z900RS cafe. For 11K out the door, on a 2019 bike with 11.7K MSRP...
Love the bike, fully adjustable suspension front and rear, traction control, killer looks, 111HP. Yes, I do LOVE triumphs, I have 2. I am just not made of money, and there ARE comparable bikes out there. I’ll give you an example. Had I bought a speed twin instead of the Z900RS cafe and let’s say I could find a new old stock Daytona instead of the CBR1000RR, I would be 10 grand, at least, more out of pocket. And in the case of the Daytona.... with a lot less bike.

My wallet does care that I can find ridiculous deals on NEW 1-2 year old bikes, not Triumphs. Hell... I can find killer deals on out of the factory same year ones... Triumph and BMW wanna be boutique brands, that is their right, but my money goes elsewhere. Because, it’s not that what they offer on features is exclusive to them, so yes, I do get more for what I pay for not buying Triumph.
 

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You think the Triumph is worth almost twice the price of an Enfield Interceptor when both are technology challenged with wire wheels, tubes tires, twin shocks, short travel forks, scant dealer locations, and importers who seem to be their brand's worst enemies?

As much as I like my AC T100 I'd rather have spent under $6k for a Royal Enfield Interceptor because both might end up orphaned in the US in a few years with no resale value and hard to get parts for. Had I done that I'd have the $5k I wouldn't have spent extra to get a Triumph to put towards a new ride.

Ducati offers far more tech in their bikes than Triumph and a better dealer network right now and BMW dealer network, parts availability, resale value, and management is so far superior to Triumph it isn't even a comparison.

The motorcycle business is not the motorcycle business anymore and manufacturers clinging to the way motorcycle business was done are done or soon will be. Even HD is feeling the heat.

Yes I do think my Triumph is worth more than 2x's any RE.

Don't forget there are many of us still around who like simple m/c's. Who the hell needs help pulling in a clutch on a bike. I bought my Bonneville's because they are what I fell in love with when I was 18 y/o. Oh by the way my Gdaughter calls me a dinosaur, and she's right.
 

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Yes I do think my Triumph is worth more than 2x's any RE.

Don't forget there are many of us still around who like simple m/c's. Who the hell needs help pulling in a clutch on a bike. I bought my Bonneville's because they are what I fell in love with when I was 18 y/o. Oh by the way my Gdaughter calls me a dinosaur, and she's right.
Both our T100s are as technically challenged (simple) as the new RE Interceptors.
Simple and straightforward with the necessary concessions to minimal electronics.

Do you consider the Poconos... mountains?
 

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Well there are many AC Triumphs with well over 100k miles of trouble free mile on them and how many REs have made it that far and now Triumphs are now WC they should out last the AC models by far, I have been riding for over 45 years still own my Norton from new, have had a few Triumphs old and new and now own 2 Triumph Thruxton's AC and WC and out of all my bikes I own my Thruxton S is the best by far for smoothness, torque and handling whether riding around town or out on the byways, High speed riding and pushing it to its limits, if I did that on a RE I don't think it would last long and yes I have rode a few REs over the years and they don't even come close to my Thruxtons whether AC or WC.
Yes things do cost more these days but 6 years on my AC Thruxton and over 40K on it also ridden hard and have had no problems with it (I haven't even done the valves adjustments yet), my WC Thruxton has only 13k on it so only time will tell how good it will be but so far I have no worries about it failing for a long life.
Then tell me any manufacture that have never had any problems even the best have recalls and the recalls I have had on my new Thruxton have just been for minor things, one was just to put a sticker on it, at lease they are admitting there needs to be a fix for a problem how many manufacture would admit that.
Our prices for new bikes in Australia are very high but that's not Triumph fault, our Governments are greedy and taxes on all new products and cars and bikes get hit the hardest, then they hit you for duty tax on new rego, high tax on our fuel, I could keep going, but I not as I got to get the bike out even when its 37c here today and its only Spring here.

Ashley
 

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Bikes for commuters and daily drivers can go either way. Economic and cheap or full on luxury boats. For comparison look at BMW cars and Mercedes compared to Acura’s or Infinity, those European cars with all bells and whistles cost 100k but in 5 yrs are worth maybe 30 and that’s a stretch to get. The Japanese hold better due to reliability. Does it have soul or move you is a factor. Do you get that giggle feeling every time you push the start button or are you climbing on a sowing machine. Price can factor into everything. Just look at the Desmosedicci Ducati, the MotoGP bike for a regular yet well off person 75k new. Now at 35-40k and gets beat by any 1098 and up, but it’s got soul and moves the earth when running. We pick our bikes for whatever reason, if you don’t like it sell and get another but don’t blame lack of tech or what a mag or sales pitch tells you. Ride it and love it or bitch about it and hate it. Your call, nobody else’s.
Remember 3D TVs were the future. Where did that future go?
 

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I find this conversation interesting.

When I originally read what the OP posted, I was like "ya, that's right" and went about my way. But, when people started talking about brands other than Royal Enfield, I found myself agreeing with them.

In my short time riding, I've had 3 bikes prior to my current one - a Yamaha FJ-09, a Yamaha XSR900 (MT-09) and a T120. My since-traded 2016 T120 felt and looked like quality as does my 2018 Street Triple RS. They were/are "solid" if that makes any sense. And, you get some nice stuff with the Street Triple RS that you don't get on say a MT-09 or (I think) Z900. Add into the equation "it's a Triumph" and I have been able to justify my purchases. However, what others have said about comparing to Japanese bikes, there are Triumph bikes that just don't make sense from a monitary standpoint (possibly even my Street Triple).

I think it really comes down to an individual decision. When you look at the total package - what you get, what you feel, reliability, dealer network, whatever else. Do YOU feel you are getting your money's worth with what Triumph (Yamaha, BWM, R.E., etc.) is offering?

For some, "it's a Triumph" or "it has character" will weigh more heavily in that decision. For others it's "bang for buck" or "reliability" or some other factor(s). Personally that's the thing I'm struggling with at the moment as I decide if I want to trade my 2018 Street Triple with 7000 miles and a rebuilt top end and replaced alternator gasket for a new 2020. I love my bike! But, do I trust it (or it's replacement) to take me across the country in addition to taking me to and from work.
 

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....I think it really comes down to an individual decision. When you look at the total package - what you get, what you feel, reliability, dealer network, whatever else. Do YOU feel you are getting your money's worth with what Triumph (Yamaha, BWM, R.E., etc.) is offering?

For some, "it's a Triumph" or "it has character" will weigh more heavily in that decision. For others it's "bang for buck" or "reliability" or some other factor(s). Personally that's the thing I'm struggling with at the moment as I decide if I want to trade my 2018 Street Triple with 7000 miles and a rebuilt top end and replaced alternator gasket for a new 2020. I love my bike! But, do I trust it (or it's replacement) to take me across the country in addition to taking me to and from work.
Reliability is and has been a big consideration for me. When I bought my first Triumph back in 2007 (a Speed Triple) I had done a lot of research and talked to several people who have owned Triumphs. The overall feeling was that in general, Triumphs were quite reliable. The cool factor of the Speed Triple was irresistible to me too. The new Speed Triple was one of the most "Japanese" motorcycles I've owned. It was put together very well, ran superbly, and was extremely refined. If I hadn't been wanting a dedicated sport-tourer, I definitely would have kept it. I'm hooked on Triumph as a motorcycle brand and am looking forward to owning more of their bikes in the future.
 

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I would consider stepping up to the speed from the street triple. It feels”solid” and handles very well. Ducatista feel the same as triumph owners for their allegiance to the Italians and I understand it. My buddy has had 3 Ducati’s ,1 Buell and a KTM 990 but loves his multistrada the most of all even with the high maintenance. He will replace it with the same even though he has had some issues. Quality and feel is the biggest answers besides they are stunning looking. I had a Sprint RS that I sold for a Suzuki GSXS and even though it was new and was a great bike it lacked connection. Back to Triumph with the Speed and even though it was more money it’s well worth it. I would like a tour version of the Tigerl like the 1050 version to compete with the multi. I looking now for one to replace my ST because of that connection. I understand the markets dictate and triumph does make some odd bikes that seem way outdated price wise and crude. More horsepower would help the small bikes for sure and the Tiger 800 seems kinda odd, a lot for sale used dirt cheap possibly due to that and the 1200 being better suited. Just my thoughts. People will wander from marque to marque but seem to go back to there first love. I bleed Ford blue and would never buy,drive any other 2door American car. Sure my mustang isn’t the greatest but I like the look, feel and I have that personal connection.
Well the conversation has gone off on a tangent now.
 

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What I find disheartening is that while Triumph makes very good motorcycles, and they seem to command premium pricing, their resale value seems to fall off a cliff. And it doesn't really seem to matter if the bike is in "concours" condition, it's value drops like a rock. I guess this is good for buyers in the secondary market, but for primary buyers, the depreciation is a buzz-kill.
I guess I'll keep riding my Tiger, as it's worth more to me than the buyers on the secondary market.
 
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