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I think of this thread fairly often, it's changed my relationship with my front brake. I've been overusing my rear because it doesn't cause fork dive. Folks told me not to, but I knew better. Also thought the DMV motorcycle manual was wrong when it talked about pressing on the right grip to go right.

Anyways I'm on a tour right now and coming down through Iowa I was thinking I don't have much opportunity for trail breaking at all. But Lord when I hit Missouri, I don't know what I'd do without hanging onto that front brake a little bit longer. Fast unfamiliar roads with good pavement and tight curves you can't see through. Maintaining some contact with that front brake into the corner can really help a lot. Trying to do the same with the rear doesn't work nearly as well, seem to give up much more handling that way.

Now I'm realizing the trade-off with engine braking too. Think someone talked about that earlier. If the revs are high then letting off the gas bleeds enough speed that there's no need or ability to get on the brakes at all. Think that's why I'm trail breaking down here more, going through the corners faster and therefore in a higher gear and it's working better.

Good roads down here to practice on. Gonna try it out in the Appalachians next ?
 

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I think of this thread fairly often, it's changed my relationship with my front brake. I've been overusing my rear because it doesn't cause fork dive. Folks told me not to, but I knew better. Also thought the DMV motorcycle manual was wrong when it talked about pressing on the right grip to go right.

Anyways I'm on a tour right now and coming down through Iowa I was thinking I don't have much opportunity for trail breaking at all. But Lord when I hit Missouri, I don't know what I'd do without hanging onto that front brake a little bit longer. Fast unfamiliar roads with good pavement and tight curves you can't see through. Maintaining some contact with that front brake into the corner can really help a lot. Trying to do the same with the rear doesn't work nearly as well, seem to give up much more handling that way.

Now I'm realizing the trade-off with engine braking too. Think someone talked about that earlier. If the revs are high then letting off the gas bleeds enough speed that there's no need or ability to get on the brakes at all. Think that's why I'm trail breaking down here more, going through the corners faster and therefore in a higher gear and it's working better.

Good roads down here to practice on. Gonna try it out in the Appalachians next ?
Glad to hear that you are taking an active role in trying to improve your own riding and are learning from this thread. I think it is important to try things for yourself and to look at where you are receiving information from. If you have any other questions about riding technique then please don't hesitate to ask, or if you have any questions about track days or riding schools either (I'm a coach with the California Superbike School).

Ride Safe!!!

Misti
 

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2017 T120 Black
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Discussion Starter #43
Glad to hear that you are taking an active role in trying to improve your own riding and are learning from this thread. I think it is important to try things for yourself and to look at where you are receiving information from. If you have any other questions about riding technique then please don't hesitate to ask, or if you have any questions about track days or riding schools either (I'm a coach with the California Superbike School).

Ride Safe!!!

Misti
Hey Misti,

I just signed up for level II at Willow Springs in October. It'd fun to meet you.
 

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Hey Misti,

I just signed up for level II at Willow Springs in October. It'd fun to meet you.
Great to hear!! You are going to have an amazing time!! Right now I'm not on the schedule for Willow Springs as I was just away for two weeks riding in Spain and am doing Laguna next week and then later in November (my husband and kids want me to stay put for a bit!) but, I do hope that you keep me posted on how the school was and what your biggest take away from it is!

Enjoy and maybe I'll meet you at a different track in the near future! :grin2::grin2:
 

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Why back when I was young I never knew you couldn’t brake when turning.
The Skills course taught me not to brake in a turn or to straighten up and brake hard coming to a stop. I also couldn’t really get counter steering to work in the parking lot.
Obviously it works and I can do it having survived riding bikes round corner despite using my brakes in the past. Until one day I was riding way to fast. Much faster than I should have been. Wrote the bike off

Now I’ve been out on the highway a few times riding up and down island to Port Hardy and From Prince Rupert down to Vancouver.
Practices get counter steering had definitely helped. Looking where you want to go for sure.
Mostly I am probably just not riding aggressively enough to need trail braking. Also it pissing rain so not keen on using to much brakes.

So more just ease of on the throttle coming into a corner and let the engine slow me down. Not really using the brakes very much.
Still, I have come into a few just a little to hot. Once with a chevron semi cutting the corner.

Just looking where I want to go counter steering to lean more. A little bit of light use of the brake from time to time .

I think so long as you don’t use it all up. You can use a bit of everything. So I guess I’ve used a little bit of trail braking. Or a light touch on the brakes if needed.

The only time I’ve really grabbed them was for a bear which decided to cross the road.
It changed its mind and bugged of back into the woods.

My pipes are just stock, but loud enough to scare bears. Or maybe it was the brakes.
 

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I endeavor to work on my skills on every ride despite having ridden since 1970 . I've been practicing trail braking after watching a few video's . All tools that expand our envelope of control are well worth learning .
 

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Discussion Starter #47
I do hope that you keep me posted on how the school was and what your biggest take away from it is!

Enjoy and maybe I'll meet you at a different track in the near future! :grin2::grin2:
Hey so I went to Willow Springs this past Saturday. It was a great day of riding.

Interestingly, I did the CSS level 2 course, so Trail Braking was our last drill of the day. That's a skill I feel pretty comfortable with, so I spent that session focussing on my entry points, especially on the faster turns (6, 7, and 9). My coach pointed out that on the slower-tight turns (2, 3, 12, 13) I was good at entry, apex, and exit, but at the faster turns I wasn't choosing a good line. Really, I was kinda blowing those turns off. Turns out that was a big mistake, and it made my ride a lot faster.

We did all of our class time with Dylan Code. The discussion about vision skills with him was enlightening and something I have to think about and practice. I'll be working on those tools for a bit.

My favorite part of the day was the lean bike, and I wanted to spend more time on it.

My coach was a guy named Chook. I thought he was very good. He did pull me off the track once for getting on the gas too early on turn 8 (the bowl). I think you made a post here about that same issue once. Common rider error of getting on the gas and adding lean angle.

Overall, a fantastic day. It's really nice to get on a machine like the S1000RR. What a fast bike! The acceleration on the main straight was exhilarating.
 

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Nice!
If you can explain a little more about 'lean bike' and 'getting on the gas too early' I'd appreciate it.
 
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Discussion Starter #49
Nice!
If you can explain a little more about 'lean bike' and 'getting on the gas too early' I'd appreciate it.
The lean bike is a motorcycle that has a contraption added to it to provide resistance to leaning the bike too far over. It is used to practice good body position. So you go around a tight circle while a coach calls to you on a walkie talkie (taped to the gas tank), giving pointers about your position. Then, you talk with the coach. Then you do it again. Great learning experience.

Turn 8 is a bowl, so you have to remain at a relatively steep lean angle for a good way through the turn. When you are doing that, you have to maintain throttle--not accelerate, as opening up the throttle early will force you to go wide. If you do get greedy with the gas (like I did), it is tempting to just lean more to get back on line while still accelerating, rather than letting off the gas a bit and resetting. This is what causes a lot of accidents, because accelerating and leaning more at the same time will cause the rear tire to give out. You can get away with it at low speed, but not at high speed.

I know this, yet I accelerated and added lean angle at the same time, and the traction control on the bike prevented me from skidding. The coach noticed this and pulled me off the track to make sure I understood what I had done wrong. A good learning experience.
 

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Hey so I went to Willow Springs this past Saturday. It was a great day of riding.

Interestingly, I did the CSS level 2 course, so Trail Braking was our last drill of the day. That's a skill I feel pretty comfortable with, so I spent that session focussing on my entry points, especially on the faster turns (6, 7, and 9). My coach pointed out that on the slower-tight turns (2, 3, 12, 13) I was good at entry, apex, and exit, but at the faster turns I wasn't choosing a good line. Really, I was kinda blowing those turns off. Turns out that was a big mistake, and it made my ride a lot faster.

We did all of our class time with Dylan Code. The discussion about vision skills with him was enlightening and something I have to think about and practice. I'll be working on those tools for a bit.

My favorite part of the day was the lean bike, and I wanted to spend more time on it.

My coach was a guy named Chook. I thought he was very good. He did pull me off the track once for getting on the gas too early on turn 8 (the bowl). I think you made a post here about that same issue once. Common rider error of getting on the gas and adding lean angle.

Overall, a fantastic day. It's really nice to get on a machine like the S1000RR. What a fast bike! The acceleration on the main straight was exhilarating.
Hey! Great write up, thanks! Sorry I couldn't meet you there, I ended up going to Las Vegas for two days over halloween with CSS so that was fun. Sounds like you were able to pick up and learn a lot and get going a little faster too! I know Chook well, so I'll tell him you thought he was a good coach :) all of us are close, like family and I'm certain you would enjoy working with all of our coaches!

Hope you come back for level 3 sometime, its all about bike/rider relationship, more body position stuff and how to move around on the bike. Good stuff :) I'm heading to Laguna Seca in a few weeks for the last course of the year and then waiting for the 20/20 schedule to come out so I can start planning. Yeeeehaw!!!

Cheers and thanks again for the write up.
 
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