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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
1972 TR6R and I note some discrepancies in oil weight, type and capacity between the Haynes publication and a photocopied Triumph Workshop Manual (a Triumph publication) Please advise on the differences shown below:

1. Crankcase oil capacity in both books is the same, 2.27L
Both manuals specify 20/50W but the Haynes manual recommends 10/30W in the winter.

2. Gearbox: The Triumph publication recommends "90W Castrol Hypoy" whereas the Haynes recommends "50W Castrol Grand Prix".

3. Chaincase: the Triumph manual states 20/50W Castrol GTX whereas the Haynes 10/30W Castrolite. Also mentioned in the Triumph manual are three holes where excess crankcase or chaincase oil can feed into each other.
 

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Hi, Tjkoko: As far as engine oil, I would recommend (and always used) a good grade of motorcycle specific 20/50; the Castrol GTX of the "old days" is not the GTX of today. Newer oils are much more automobile specific and have new additives that may not be the best for the older engines and tappets. I always used Torco, but Valvoline makes oils with zinc and ZDDP in them, which the older engines "like" better. You can also buy the zinc/ZDDP additive separately, but it should be used as directed..........it's been said that too much of it is not a good thing.
The primary case can be run with a 20/20 oil of the same type, as there isn't much exchanging of oils happening; but, I have used 20/50 with no detrimental results, also.
The gearbox only needs a good 90 weight hypoid gear oil, but some folks do worry about the bronze bushings being affected by it. Suffice to say that I used an EP 80/140 hypoid in my '70 for the last 35 years with no problems whatsoever.
Of course, you do realize that by your asking, and my answering, these questions, "Pandora's Box" has been opened! Oil questions, and their replies, are right up there with the recommending of politicians, father confessors and tires.......just to name a few!
Just the "questionable wisdom" of the "village idiot", that's all: Jim
 
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Hi,

some discrepancies
between the Haynes publication and
Now you know why Haynes is nicknamed "Heinous", "Haynes Christian Andersen", etc. :rofl

Haynes is good for ... propping up the short leg of a wobbly bench, etc. :D

Also mentioned in the Triumph manual are three holes where excess crankcase or chaincase oil can feed into each other.
This is true of all Triumph twins built after late in the '69 season. Before then, oil in the primary could be specific just to lubricate the chain and clutch.

After, the primary chaincase doubled as a plenum chamber for the crankcase ventilation; oil vapour droplets condensing there or in the front part of the vent hose drain to the bottom of the chaincase. Oil level below the holes between chaincase and crankcase lubricated the chain and clutch; any excess returned to the crankcase to be scavenged as normal. However, it does mean that only engine oil can be put in the chaincase. For this reason, engine oil with friction modifiers must be avoided - not having friction in the clutch isn't something you want. :) Always check the spec. of any engine oil you intend to buy for "JASO MA2".

Hth.

Regards,
 

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You don't state your country so it's hard to make recommendations as USA, UK, Euro products available differ.

On primary breather eng like yours the primary & eng oil mix constantly & freely. Not quickly, but they mix. So primary oil is what eng oil is on a 72. The oil comes through the left main bearing. This bearing doesn't have a seal like prior motors did. The 3 little holes return oil to crank case. The primary oil will fluctuate slightly depending on road speed. Slow speed makes higher level. High speed lowers primary level slightly. The oil level change will be seen it frame oil level, maybe 1/4-3/8". Hot oil will raise level also, 1/2-3/4" in frame. So when you see changes don't be alarmed.

Indeed oil is a personal thing & Pandora's box. If in USA hard to beat Mobil1 20-50. I use it because it withstands heat very well, has high zinc level & is very good for clutch operation. Allows good freeing of plates cold & reduces slip. It's very easy to come by in USA.

Old school 90w trans oil or 50w eng oil are no longer made. I use Stay Lube 85w90 part # SL24229. Specifically states on container non corrosive to copper, bronze, non ferrous bushings.

Hanes manuals have good info in them, Triumph is maybe a little better. Both is good to have. Triumph manual & owner's handbooks have discrepancies also. So it can be confusing.

Don
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
You don't state your country so it's hard to make recommendations as USA, UK, Euro products available differ..............
I live in the USA.

I plan to use:

1. Crankcase: Castrol 20W50 (non synthetic) along with some Lucas Racing ZDDP TB Zinc-Plus additive.

2. Gearbox: Lucas Heavy Duty High Performance SAE 80W-90 Gear Oil.


Lemme' know if you see something here "dangerous" to the engine/transmission.
 

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The oils you have picked will be just dandy.I have recently used a 20/60 race oil.Of course,it just does not go any faster than non racing oil so wasted my money.Makes it a little harder to turn over with my bad knee though. Ouch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
............Indeed oil is a personal thing & Pandora's box. ..................
Now that I think about, yes, a Pandora's box. Darn, it almost gets into fisticuffs over at a 1911 forum and a bicycle forum. Break out the popcorn, the boxing gloves if you choose and eat some popcorn. But both Mobil 1 and Sta-Lube sound like excellent choices.

Thanks, all
 

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Now that I think about, yes, a Pandora's box. Darn, it almost gets into fisticuffs over at a 1911 and a bicycle forum. Break out the popcorn. But both Mobil 1 and Sta-Lube sound like excellent choices.

Thanks, all
I thought synthetics didn't have the additives we need on these older engines, wouldn't that preclude using Mobil 1. Can you put the additives in the synthetic successfully?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
.............Indeed oil is a personal thing & Pandora's box. If in USA hard to beat Mobil1 20-50. I use it because it withstands heat very well, has high zinc level & is very good for clutch operation. Allows good freeing of plates cold & reduces slip. It's very easy to come by in USA...........
I thought synthetics didn't have the additives we need on these older engines, wouldn't that preclude using Mobil 1. Can you put the additives in the synthetic successfully?
...what it states in the first quote shown above. I'll need to checkout the spec sheet on Mobile 1 however. Here, checkout the Mobile 1 spec sheet.

And this page.
 

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Good to know, I've always liked using Mobile1 since I started using it in my new 1980 Ford van. 3-4mpg better and almost 20° cooler running temps when in L.A..
Speaking of temps, expected to be 109° in Vegas tomorrow and 100° in Portland,Ore.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Good to know, I've always liked using Mobile1 since I started using it in my new 1980 Ford van. 3-4mpg better and almost 20° cooler running temps when in L.A..
Speaking of temps, expected to be 109° in Vegas tomorrow and 100° in Portland,Ore.
Okay Mobile makes a V Twin Mobile 1 20W-50 with high zinc and phosphorous and also there's a Valvoline VR1 20W-50 oil with zinc and phosphorous additives. Both oils look really good to me as far as a motorcycle application goes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
.............Speaking of temps, expected to be 109° in Vegas tomorrow and 100° in Portland,Ore.
Down here in Waycross we're roasting in spite of air conditioning.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Waycross,Ga.? At least you have AC, mines down. It' been Heavy downpours here today keeping the temp reasonable.
Next to the Okefenokee where we run dawgs and hawgs!:motorbike2
 

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It's 10W30 not 10-30W. The "W" is short for winter.
The oil problem has been sorted by the Big Four and Harley. Back in the the mid 1990's when the major motorcycle manufacturers were having many of the same problems we were having. Break-in problems, clutch slippage and premature transmission wear. They brought their concerns to the API who set the standards for oil. They insisted that the oil was backward compatible and it was not the oil causing their problems. So they took their concerns to their equivalent of API, the Japanese Automobile Standards Organization (JASO).

To make this short they came to the same conclusion as the manufacturers and came up with their own standard for oil. Basically it was the old API standard "SG" which was the last oil not to be designated as "Energy Saving".

We have been using synthetic oils for years - ones rated as 4T or as motorcycle oil. You do not want to use oil blended to be "Energy Conserving" - mineral OR synthetic. We have a high mileage Vincent, noted for having a lot of problems with cams and lifters, that looks as good today as the day it was assembled.

So what you are looking for is and oil rated SG (SJ if a synthetic) JASO MA2. This oil only became available about 10 years ago and has become almost universally marketed by all of the major oil manufacturers. It has been labels 4T for four stroke engines and 2T for two strokes. You can use this oil with confidence that your are doing everything you can do to protect your engine. All you need to be concerned about is the brand you "committee" or expert recommends.

Now 10W30 would be appropriate in areas where winter brings ambient air temperatures near 10° F. I doubt there are many who would be riding their bikes at these temperatures.

What is important is you use 20W50 if you choose to use a multi-grade. The 20W is much more appropriate for the lowest temperatures we might ride in, but the 50 will give you the proper viscosity for typical ambient temperatures. The viscosity changes with ambient air temperature to provide the average 10 to 15 viscosity at he rod bearings that will allow the hydro-dynamic wedge to form. It is the hydro-dynamic wedge, not the oil pressure, that protects the rod bearings. If the oil's viscosity is too low, or too high for the wedge to form you will damage the bearings. When Triumph, BSA and Norton recommended 20w50 oil they knew what they were doing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Okay and again this is a bike manufactured in 1972. If using a synthetic oil, will there be any concern if going back to a non synthetic oil as far as the seals are concerned??????
 

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Okay and again this is a bike manufactured in 1972. If using a synthetic oil, will there be any concern if going back to a non synthetic oil as far as the seals are concerned??????
There shouldn't. It's common knowledge now that you can mix synthetics with Dino oils without any negative concerns.
 

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I've been workin as automotive tech since 1969. Been at Mercedes dealer since '82.

We've been using both regular & synthetic for years. I have not observed oil leaks worse or less when changing back & forth it doesn't matter.

Now days oil change is 10-13k miles on cars. These are suppose to be synthetic only. Many times I've seen regular oil used & if they are late say 15k the oil is already getting gooy when cold & wants to jell. Usually takes synthetic 20-30k to get like that.

High temps kill normal oil more quickly.

We also use Shell Rotella 15-40 long life which is very good with cam wear. However it still cannot last like Mobil 1.

Again this are car oils & will make wet clutch slip bad. Car oils has no zinc because zinc coats the catalytic converter & ruins them. Back in the late 70s we were suppose to change cats every 60 k miles or so. Porsches used thermal reactors to get around that.

Many manufacturers list zinc on their spec sheets. V-twin is at or near the top. The clutch is also a big deal. All the guys that use VTwin like the clutch operation with it.

Some feel it's better than ATF in old bike primaries. Personally I feel it's really good for chain also.

In any case you will not hurt anything.
Don
 
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