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T140 rear wheel

5K views 35 replies 13 participants last post by  76barnfind 
#1 ·
I’m looking for some information on the rear wheel of my 76 Bonnie . There are two studs in the Rim that are threaded I have no idea why they are there and what the purpose is for them . I i’m getting ready to swap the tires I haven’t remove them from the rims yet just wondering why those threaded studs are there.
Cheers
 
#3 ·
Hi,
76 Bonnie
rear wheel
two studs in the Rim
security bolts or rimlocks. They keep the tyre on the wheel should you have a sudden puncture.
+1. Each "stud" is attached to - essentially - a big pad; when the nut's tight on the "stud", the pad sandwiches the tyre beads between it and the rim; if the tyre loses air pressure (that normally keeps the beads in the rim), the tyre won't come off the rim.

Fwiw, I've experienced "sudden punctures" both with and without rimlocks; while either's a natural laxative, with rimlocks definitely less so. (y)

curse them when you put [the tyre] back on.
For removing the old tyre, having either removed both rimlocks' nuts or unscrewed them as far as the ends of the studs, refit the rimlocks between the rim and the new rimtape and refit each lock's nut just on the end of the stud.

When fitting one tyre bead, as you get close to a lock, push on the end of the lock's stud - nut on the stud will prevent the lock dropping into the tyre, rimtape will keep the lock in position and push the stud back out when you release it.

Fit the tube an put some air in it.

When fitting the second tyre bead, again as you get close to a lock, same procedure as fitting the first tyre bead, this time both the rimtape and the tube will keep the lock in position and push the stud back out when you release it.

Seat the tyre in the rim as normal. When you're happy the tyre's seated correctly all round, tighten the rimlocks' nuts on to the rim - no need to go mad; as you'll have seen, a rimlock sandwiches the beads over quite a distance.

Hth.

Regards,
 
#9 ·
StuartMac, the grommet certainly is a better solution. I frankly never considered any other solution than the "bolt" idea. In my own defense, I read a comment on another thread some time back about rim locks where a regular contributor here said they didn't run the locks but just put in a stainless bolt in its place, I suppose to fill the hole and keep the original look. I mounted my own tires on my 71 Bonne and kept the locks in place. It was a real challenge but it can be done. :)
 
#10 ·
i don't run rim locks on anything anymore. many years ago i bought a couple of twenty-dollar shouldered borrani aluminum rims and drilled the rear in four places each side to insert sheet metal screws. a clymer manual speed trick, and i was sure it would make me faster. but since then i've given up on any of the locking.

i use two wraps of duct tape around the inside instead of rim tape. over those holes i run two more very short pieces to keep the tube from bulging through.
 
#12 ·
I have no rim locks. Never used them at all. I use a bolt to fill the hole in the rim with a head ground down so it sits under the rim tape. I do regular tyre checks and pressure checks. Had 2 punctures in 50 years on bikes. Both on rear tyre but it did stay on the rim. No front tyre punctures at all in 50 years.
 
#14 ·
rimlocks are a PITA to balance, I never use them, had 2 express flats in my time [many more slower ones], one front [scary as] and one rear [scary but not as scary as the front]. Held both and came to a stop. Both were at some speed [+80km/h], but you could feel straight away that something was imminent, you got a nanosecond warning an that probably saved me from laying it [the bike] down.

BTW neither tyre was repairable, a new tube was needed.
 
#15 ·
To avoid some risk of punctures, i change the rear tyre when it still has a fair bit of tread left in the centre. About 3000 miles use. Front tyres ,i have never had one wear down much as i do not use brakes very much. Front tyres get changed due to age. Engine braking then just a touch to come to a halt. Rear brake, i can barely use due to having a foot that does not bend. I have to stamp on it with my heel if needed. That might seem difficult if you try it but i had this problem since 1980.
I never patch tubes and i also change tubes at tyre change time.
 
#16 ·
You’re in good company Rambo!

"I often wondered what that pedal did"
Carl Fogarty.


 
#17 ·
Hi 76Barnfind, Changing tires is a lot of hard work. Yes they fit very tight. Correct tire irons are a must. Rim locks (tyre security bolt as Triumph calls them) make the job even tougher. Taking to shop is fine if you don't want to do it. Why not pay to have someone do it, nothing wrong with that. I was talking to fellow at cycle gear he'd never done an old Triumph before. The old guys knew how to do them though.

Have shop balance rear wheel while they have it. Insist they do. May be extra charge. Balancing both wheels really calms bike at higher speeds 60-70 mph+. Depending on how far out of balance it is makes a huge difference on highway. I know shop manual says rear balance isn't needed. I don't agree with that. Front defiantly needs good
balance.

I've done a lot of Triumph tires. Every time I do one, I learn something to make it easier. With some practice, not big deal, even though it's hard work.

Genuine Motion Pro tire irons are my irons of choice. Having correct irons make a huge difference. 2 sets are most helpful. At least a 2nd long black one. Polish both ends well to make them very smooth. Cut corners off of plastic oil bottles to make pads to protect rims so irons don't mar them.

Motion Pro Assorted Tire Irons - Cycle Gear

Mark valve stem hole so you don't put lock or stem in wrong hole.

Here's how I take out rim locks. Put PVC tube 1" or 1-1/4" on rim to hold bead up. Reach in with curved iron & push opposite bead down. Or reach around use small iron to hold bead back against far rim side. Push lock into tire. Reach into tire with 2 fingers & lift out lock. It will work through the gap if you wiggle it right. Going back in is opposite. Going in with new tire is harder as new tire beads really want to stay flat together. This can also be used to easily install valve stem into rim. Install nuts on lock bolts & valve stem a few turns only at this time.

Use a bright flashlight going on. Look at tire bead/rim area. You must be able to see iron will not pinch tube. There is no excuse to pinch tube. Look & verify tube is not getting pinched.

Use plenty of lube. Keep far side of tire bead in drop center where spokes are. There is no reason to over stretch tire & tear a bead. Start last side of tire opposite valve stem. Work evenly side to side towards valve stem. Finish at valve stem. The rim locks keep pushed into tire. Tube will easily compress to allow this. The tire bead will fit in drop center next to shaft of rim lock as you go. Put a little more air in tube to move beads to rim. Verify tube is not trapped in tire bead/rim interface. Verify valve stem is straight & true out of rim. Again push bolt of rim lock forcing lock into tire. Finally fill tube fully to bead tire. Verify bead looks fully seated both sides. Let most the air out. Yet again push rim lock inwards. Let it pop out. Verify bolt is straight showing lock is centered over beads. Now run nuts down. We never want nuts to center locks or stems. You want those centered before you tighten nuts. When all looks good, final tighten nuts.

Leap frog your irons going back on. Just a little at a time. An inch or so especially as you get around far enough for bead to start getting tight. I hold irons with my knees. I like to work on blanket spread out on lawn. Easier on your knees. An assistant to help hold irons as you go is very helpful.

Slightly inflate tube before installing tube. How much?? It takes some experiments depending on tire size. I'll post photo to give a clue. You want it just hold its shape.

Practice makes perfect. Tip on tight fitting tires like Roadriders use spray furniture polish as lube. I use Pledge as that's what my wife buys. I don't know that brand matters. I've never seen Roadrider tire slip from using polish. They may never bead up without the polish. I have real tire mounting lube. Didn't help. Needed Pledge to bead it. Even then took 55#. K70s fit much easier. Normal tire lube from tire shop works well.

Next tire I'll get some better photos. I'll try to video it.

Some put rim strip over rim locks. I've never done that. Factory never did that. It might work better?
Don
 

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#18 ·
Hi 76Barnfind, Changing tires is a lot of hard work. Yes they fit very tight. Correct tire irons are a must. Rim locks (tyre security bolt as Triumph calls them) make the job even tougher. Taking to shop is fine if you don't want to do it. Why not pay to have someone do it, nothing wrong with that. I was talking to fellow at cycle gear he'd never done an old Triumph before. The old guys knew how to do them though.

Have shop balance rear wheel while they have it. Insist they do. May be extra charge. Balancing both wheels really calms bike at higher speeds 60-70 mph+. Depending on how far out of balance it is makes a huge difference on highway. I know shop manual says rear balance isn't needed. I don't agree with that. Front defiantly needs good
balance.

I've done a lot of Triumph tires. Every time I do one, I learn something to make it easier. With some practice, not big deal, even though it's hard work.

Genuine Motion Pro tire irons are my irons of choice. Having correct irons make a huge difference. 2 sets are most helpful. At least a 2nd long black one. Polish both ends well to make them very smooth. Cut corners off of plastic oil bottles to make pads to protect rims so irons don't mar them.

Motion Pro Assorted Tire Irons - Cycle Gear

Mark valve stem hole so you don't put lock or stem in wrong hole.

Here's how I take out rim locks. Put PVC tube 1" or 1-1/4" on rim to hold bead up. Reach in with curved iron & push opposite bead down. Or reach around use small iron to hold bead back against far rim side. Push lock into tire. Reach into tire with 2 fingers & lift out lock. It will work through the gap if you wiggle it right. Going back in is opposite. Going in with new tire is harder as new tire beads really want to stay flat together. This can also be used to easily install valve stem into rim. Install nuts on lock bolts & valve stem a few turns only at this time.

Use a bright flashlight going on. Look at tire bead/rim area. You must be able to see iron will not pinch tube. There is no excuse to pinch tube. Look & verify tube is not getting pinched.

Use plenty of lube. Keep far side of tire bead in drop center where spokes are. There is no reason to over stretch tire & tear a bead. Start last side of tire opposite valve stem. Work evenly side to side towards valve stem. Finish at valve stem. The rim locks keep pushed into tire. Tube will easily compress to allow this. The tire bead will fit in drop center next to shaft of rim lock as you go. Put a little more air in tube to move beads to rim. Verify tube is not trapped in tire bead/rim interface. Verify valve stem is straight & true out of rim. Again push bolt of rim lock forcing lock into tire. Finally fill tube fully to bead tire. Verify bead looks fully seated both sides. Let most the air out. Yet again push rim lock inwards. Let it pop out. Verify bolt is straight showing lock is centered over beads. Now run nuts down. We never want nuts to center locks or stems. You want those centered before you tighten nuts. When all looks good, final tighten nuts.

Leap frog your irons going back on. Just a little at a time. An inch or so especially as you get around far enough for bead to start getting tight. I hold irons with my knees. I like to work on blanket spread out on lawn. Easier on your knees. An assistant to help hold irons as you go is very helpful.

Slightly inflate tube before installing tube. How much?? It takes some experiments depending on tire size. I'll post photo to give a clue. You want it just hold its shape.

Practice makes perfect. Tip on tight fitting tires like Roadriders use spray furniture polish as lube. I use Pledge as that's what my wife buys. I don't know that brand matters. I've never seen Roadrider tire slip from using polish. They may never bead up without the polish. I have real tire mounting lube. Didn't help. Needed Pledge to bead it. Even then took 55#. K70s fit much easier. Normal tire lube from tire shop works well.

Next tire I'll get some better photos. I'll try to video it.

Some put rim strip over rim locks. I've never done that. Factory never did that. It might work better?
Don
Hi Don thanks for the info. There aren’t many shops around me that work on the older bikes . I did find one yesterday, took my wheels there they had not worked on Triumph wheels before so I returned without leaving them . Also they said they couldn’t do the front wheel because when I replaced the front bearings I did a mock up and installed the wheel they said they couldn’t do it with the axles still attached to the wheel. I did not feel comfortable leaving it there for them to do the work. I’ll give it another shot using your description and instructions. Do you think heating the tire would help in getting them off a little easier? Thanks again.
Cheers ,Jack
 
#19 ·
Hi Jack, For sure a warm tire will be more pliable. Depends on how cold is cold. I've done them on 65f days, no heat. If possible I'll set wheel, tires in sun.

Start with front it's much easier. Look over some youtube videos to gain some ideas. Lunmad has one. He uses a hammer.... I've never done that. I worked at Harley dealer in '70&71. Old Harelys especially Sportsters had rims similar to Triumph. I did lots of tires there. No rim locks. They used sheet metal screws through rim side into bead... My '70 Triumph a trade in was my first experience with rim locks. They are still common on dirt bikes. I've done lots of Triumph tires in last few years. Gotten pretty good at it now.

The shop is thinking they'll use a modern tire machine & lift bead like on car. That's why they want axle out. They'll probably bend rim.
Don
 
#20 ·
Hi Jack, For sure a warm tire will be more pliable. Depends on how cold is cold. I've done them on 65f days, no heat. If possible I'll set wheel, tires in sun.

Start with front it's much easier. Look over some youtube videos to gain some ideas. Lunmad has one. He uses a hammer.... I've never done that. I worked at Harley dealer in '70&71. Old Harelys especially Sportsters had rims similar to Triumph. I did lots of tires there. No rim locks. They used sheet metal screws through rim side into bead... My '70 Triumph a trade in was my first experience with rim locks. They are still common on dirt bikes. I've done lots of Triumph tires in last few years. Gotten pretty good at it now.

The shop is thinking they'll use a modern tire machine & lift bead like on car. That's why they want axle out. They'll probably bend rim.
Don
Thanks again for the info Don . I am taking them to a shop in Pennsylvania that has been working on triumphs since the 60s it’s where I bought them from also. Don’t feel like taking any chances between the asphalt and me . Cheers
 
#21 ·
Hi Jack, A wise choice. They should have no problems.

You might want to get some spoke weights. Or ask if they have the original type. Kind of streamlined. A perfect compliment to K70 tires. I balance mine on my wheel truing stand. It has center points that fit front axle or into rear wheel bearings.
Get 5 or 6 of each size.
Modern stick on weights just don’t look right to me.
Don
 
#22 ·
Hi Jack, A wise choice. They should have no problems.

You might want to get some spoke weights. Or ask if they have the original type. Kind of streamlined. A perfect compliment to K70 tires. I balance mine on my wheel truing stand. It has center points that fit front axle or into rear wheel bearings.
Get 5 or 6 of each size.
Modern stick on weights just don’t look right to me.
Don
I agree about the weights. I didn’t know to ask but I am guessing they will have them there , the owner most definitely knows his stuff.
Cheers
 
#23 ·
Hi Jack, I wouldn't count on anything... If you care about the weights, ask or get some. Cut down weights is a custom thing. I don't know they'd do that?? It's worth the extra $$ if they would. You can stagger normal ones to get similar effect. That's kind of time consuming. Static balance is fine for these skinny tires. Fat tires need spin (dynamic) balance.

I feel it's worth splitting hairs on balance. I do it until tire is stationary in any position. With a little practice very easy to get that. You can search youtube vids on Motorcycle tire static balancing.

Here's a few more photos on tire changing that might help somebody. Might bring some previous thoughts together. I couldn't find ones installing tire. I may not have taken any.

Here's a youtube on tire removal, without rim locks. No doubt that would scratch rim! Use rim protectors!! Leap frogging irons makes it easier.

(151) How To Change a Motorcycle Tire By Yourself - YouTube
Don
 

Attachments

#24 ·
Hi Jack, I wouldn't count on anything... If you care about the weights, ask or get some. Cut down weights is a custom thing. I don't know they'd do that?? It's worth the extra $$ if they would. You can stagger normal ones to get similar effect. That's kind of time consuming. Static balance is fine for these skinny tires. Fat tires need spin (dynamic) balance.

I feel it's worth splitting hairs on balance. I do it until tire is stationary in any position. With a little practice very easy to get that. You can search youtube vids on Motorcycle tire static balancing.

Here's a few more photos on tire changing that might help somebody. Might bring some previous thoughts together. I couldn't find ones installing tire. I may not have taken any.

Here's a youtube on tire removal, without rim locks. No doubt that would scratch rim! Use rim protectors!! Leap frogging irons makes it easier.

(151) How To Change a Motorcycle Tire By Yourself - YouTube
Don
I’ll keep you posted on the outcome. They are being mounted today . I have a good feeling with these guys hopefully my gut feeling is dialed in 🤞🏼
Cheers
 
#25 ·
Am I the only one thinking rim locks were originally used to keep the tire in place when you ran it at a lower pressure to use on the dirt? Unpaved roads are still common where I live and were much more common 50 years ago. See above where TR7RVMan notes that dirt bikes still use them. I just took delivery of a 2019 Tiger 800 XCA, now I am interested as to whether it has rim locks. But the weather here in Michigan is going to keep me out of the unheated garage until tomorrow.
 
#26 ·
Hi Josh,
Am I the only one thinking rim locks were originally used to keep the tire in place when you ran it at a lower pressure to use on the dirt?
The other reason for rimlocks on the rear wheel is so the rider can deliberately reduce tyre pressure for riding riding on soft ground - low pressure without rimlocks, then some engines could move the rim on the tyre, potentially pulling the valve out of the tube.
;)

just took delivery of a 2019 Tiger 800 XCA, now I am interested as to whether it has rim locks.
Might not need them, the "WM" rim cross-sections the old British motorcycle industry used haven't been made new for decades.

Hth.

Regards,
 
#29 ·
Hi
I use plumbers solder wrapped on the spokes for a traditional 1960’s look to wheel balancing.
(No rim locks)
A pice of rubber/wood to protect the back rim and the tyre bead on the front jaw of a large vice will shift the rubber in a tough bead break situation.
Regards
Peg.
 
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#30 ·
Lead solder is a common balance weight. Wrap a bit of insulating tape around it for that authentic, did it meself look. I still change my own tyres on bikes. It is getting to be a strain as i get older but i have some boys who can help if i instruct. Using 5 tyre levers makes it fairly easy. I use a carpenters G clamp to break the beads. Old tricks. Modern tubeless is best left for someone with a machine. Last time i fitted a tyre on a 1981 Honda with a 16 inch rim, it was a dog to do. Never again with just tyre levers.
 
#32 ·
I’m looking for some information on the rear wheel of my 76 Bonnie . There are two studs in the Rim that are threaded I have no idea why they are there and what the purpose is for them . I i’m getting ready to swap the tires I haven’t remove them from the rims yet just wondering why those threaded studs are there.
Cheers
I took mine off. Always, I check my air pressure before I go for a ride. I really don't think that our bikes are going to produce enough power for the rear tire to slip on the rim.
 
#33 ·
#36 ·
Hi 76Barnfind, Outstanding!! Thank God there are a few real shops around. Not many left.

What is name of this shop? The owners in your area should know where they can get the whole job done.

So good you're able to move on with project.
Don
Hi Don the name of the shop is Hermy’s in Port Clinton , Pa about one hour north of Harrisburg Pennsylvania. They started in business in 1963 , they are a BMW and triumph dealer real nice facility . They have separate show rooms for BMW and for triumph and separate areas for apparel. They are a family owned and operated business, definitely worth the two hour trip from Baltimore. I would definitely recommend them to anybody in the area. Nice people and Hermy knows as much as anybody can know about Triumphs .
Cheers
 
#35 ·
Regarding modern bikes, I think most of them have "safety bead" type rims. Should you have blowout the tire bead generally will not leave rim. You see this on cars all the time. A blow out & tire disintegrates quickly, leaving a ring of rubber & the bead still seated tight.

Safety rims have a raised edge on flat of rim. So bead is contained by this raised area so it can't slide into drop center when tire is flat. The tire bead must go into drop center to come over top of rim outer edge. You can feel & usually hear a pop when inflating tire after mounting, as the bead pops over the safety raised area.

Harley started this early on in 60s. In later 60s & by early 70s even Sportsters had safety rims so no more screws to lock bead.

If you don't want to deal with rim locks, leave them off. If things go bad with a flat, you'll ride it out or not. End of day they are no big deal to work with changing tires. You just have to know how to deal with them. It is no fight once you understand how to deal with them.
Don
 
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