Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums banner

1 - 20 of 95 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
458 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Guys I just had my manhood handed back to me yesterday. My buddy just bought a 2012 Harley Road Glide. He ran up to Reno, NV for Street Vibrations and put 800 miles on it so it's pretty much broke in.

Yesterday we found a straight bit of road and did roll on races from 1st and 2nd gear up to 100mph and every time he inched away from me. His bike weighs 850 lbs - he weighs 225 lbs. His Harley is bone stock with the 103 ci engine. My bike has the 1600, CAT removed and Hogslayers slip-ons with the Triumph Dealer TOR tune.

I had a shop dyno my bike right after my mods because I wanted to make sure the dealer TOR tune air/fuel mixture was safe (not too lean). I paid extra for them to do a few pulls to test for torque and HP as well. My readings to rear wheel are thus: Max HP 70.61, Max Torque 92.58. Run conditions: Temp 81.83F, Humidity: 35%.

Needless to say I am NOT happy. All this smug talk we have about leaving the Harley's in the dust just isn't so anymore. So if any of you have dyno'd your bikes and got drastically different numbers - I'd like to hear. If you have the 1700, either purchased that way or via BB kit and dyno'd it, I'd love to see your numbers.

If anyone is running my setup and is using a tune different than the dealer TOR tune that they feel has made a significant difference I am all ears. I'm at 9,500 miles and am banking every spare bit of change I can so I can get the BB kit at the 12,000 mile mark. Until then I will just be...um, slow! :mad:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,748 Posts
Hmmmm....When I was headed south toward work on highway 160 last Friday I kept seeing Harleys both alone and in groups headed north. I thought that was odd, then later I realized Street Vibrations was going on.

I have a solution to your problem. You see, I never had any doubt about my ability to take any of the 50 or so HD's I passed. It's simple really. It's called a Speed Triple.

:D
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
9,598 Posts
Theres your problem....cat delete will give you a LOSS of power w/o the proper tune. hogslayers or not. And your dyno numbers show it. Those are very low, even lower than a bone stock 1600. Guys with any aftermarket pipes with cat delete and the PROPER tune are getting a lot more power. problem is, theres a great cat delete tune floating around, tho i can't devudge where w/o getting banned. But thats not your problem because i could get it to you. Your problem is it's for the 1700. So i don't know what to tell you cept either get a tuning solution like a PC or tuneboy and have it dyno tuned, or get the 1700 kit and use the tune i'm using. I assure you no road glide will pull mine, not even close. My bird with 1700, short tors and cat delete and that tune makes my bike as it was when it was a 1600 feel like a honda rebel 250. The stock 1600 IS a bit of a dog, and cat delete w/o the right tune is detrimental to your bikes power. put the cat on and i bet you pull him or stay even. many have pulled the cat w/o a proper tune and reported loss of power. So as weak as the stock 1600 is it's no wonder. Mine as a 1600 wasn't bad with the tors and tune. But it's a monster now compared to that.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
9,598 Posts
Thinking....you might check out the "other' place. There is at least one or 2 guys that took those 1700 custom maps and transferred the cam timings from the 1600 tors map into them. That way they have the fueling that was dyno developed for the 1700 and the cam timing for the 1600 tors tune. They seemed to like the results. there are 2 of this guy's tunes that are custom dyno maps, one with and one without cat. If you have tuneecu you can try one of those right now if one is cat delete, which i think is the case. But you'll have to search there. look in the "tune repository" section. I think you'll find the threads/posts there.

Another option is to get the BB kit cams only since thats what is responsible for the majority of the BB kit's power, then use the 1700 cat delete tune. A few have done the cams only and they seem to find it works well. I bet it gets you 80% of the power of the BB, plus you can then use those tunes as they are.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
351 Posts
I did'nt think the 103 ci. was a stock engine???
Depends on the bike and what options were put on it. I have three friends with 103 c.i. motors in their HDs, a Street Glide, a Road Glide and an Ultra Classic. The Street Glide has a stage 2 kit and will take the other two, but none of the 3 have been able to pull away from my 1700.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
390 Posts
Your bike isnt tuned right ,end of story. Of course if you had a triple you could absolutly leave in the dust any cruiser no matter how much money they dumped into there garage queen.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
9,598 Posts
Your bike isnt tuned right ,end of story. Of course if you had a triple you could absolutly leave in the dust any cruiser no matter how much money they dumped into there garage queen.
Yes, but a bike with a rocket engine would slay your tiger. Oh wait.....two totally different classes....apples and oranges.....my mistake. ;)
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
390 Posts
Yes, but a bike with a rocket engine would slay your tiger. Oh wait.....two totally different classes....apples and oranges.....my mistake. ;)
Maybe so dizzco but the first part of my statement is right on the money.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
G'day Daryl,

My Tbird 1600 has Staintune pipes, CAT removed (had the TOR tune too) and is stock otherwise. The freeflowing pipes caused popping and backfiring so I fitted a power commander 5 and had the bike dynotuned.

The first run numbers were very similar to yours with max power 73.43hp and max torque 94.27ft-lbs temp 18.97C humidity 29%

Second run after tweaking, max power 78.26hp and 101.17ft-lbs

My bike feels way more "lively" and the butt dyno can really feel the improvement.
Maybe a PCV will realise the potential of your bike.

 

·
Banned
Joined
·
9,598 Posts
You can get even more than that by using a tuneboy or tuneECU (if u can find a tuner who will use tuneECU) because they can be used to also change the timing which the power commander can't do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,978 Posts
You can get even more than that by using a tuneboy or tuneECU (if u can find a tuner who will use tuneECU) because they can be used to also change the timing which the power commander can't do.
I am not sure whether it is yet available for the 'bird, but for certain twin-cylinder engines the Power Commander V module now comes with built-in Ignition Control.

 

·
Banned
Joined
·
9,598 Posts
Well thats good to hear ! I may even consider it eventually if thats the case. But it seems you are saying the PC5 only has it for certain bikes? Seems odd they'd do that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
458 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Theres your problem....cat delete will give you a LOSS of power w/o the proper tune. hogslayers or not. And your dyno numbers show it. Those are very low, even lower than a bone stock 1600. Guys with any aftermarket pipes with cat delete and the PROPER tune are getting a lot more power. problem is, theres a great cat delete tune floating around, tho i can't devudge where w/o getting banned. But thats not your problem because i could get it to you. Your problem is it's for the 1700. So i don't know what to tell you cept either get a tuning solution like a PC or tuneboy and have it dyno tuned, or get the 1700 kit and use the tune i'm using. I assure you no road glide will pull mine, not even close. My bird with 1700, short tors and cat delete and that tune makes my bike as it was when it was a 1600 feel like a honda rebel 250. The stock 1600 IS a bit of a dog, and cat delete w/o the right tune is detrimental to your bikes power. put the cat on and i bet you pull him or stay even. many have pulled the cat w/o a proper tune and reported loss of power. So as weak as the stock 1600 is it's no wonder. Mine as a 1600 wasn't bad with the tors and tune. But it's a monster now compared to that.
I sent you a PM
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
458 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
British-Customs is selling the PC5 for $369.95. I think that and a dyno Tune will run me about $700. Thing is I've been saving for the BB kit and I'm just about there - I'm at 9,500 miles but was thinking of waiting until my 12k to have the BB kit installed. I know you guys can't answer my question for me, just thinking out loud here - but the what if in my mind is - what if a PC5 and dyno tune makes me happy? I'll just save a lot of money not having the BB kit installed - because after the BB kit - I'll probably need to mess with tuning all over again and even more money - unless Dazco can send me that magic tune you run...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
458 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
G'day Daryl,

My Tbird 1600 has Staintune pipes, CAT removed (had the TOR tune too) and is stock otherwise. The freeflowing pipes caused popping and backfiring so I fitted a power commander 5 and had the bike dynotuned.

The first run numbers were very similar to yours with max power 73.43hp and max torque 94.27ft-lbs temp 18.97C humidity 29%

Second run after tweaking, max power 78.26hp and 101.17ft-lbs

My bike feels way more "lively" and the butt dyno can really feel the improvement.
Maybe a PCV will realise the potential of your bike.

I looked long and hard at the StainTune exhaust and IMO they had the best sound hands down! Glad it's working good for you - my mind is spinning out of control right now. Something I need to sit down and run the numbers on is this - I could put my stock, seat, CAT, pipes, pegs on my bike and put it up for sale. I think re-sale on the Birds is really high. Then instead of putting a ton of money into the BB kit - go buy a Storm that already has the headlight I like, and the 1700 kit - then I can put my pipes and whatnot on it...need to find out here how far off I am in the numbers....hmmmm.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,748 Posts
Daryl, instead of dropping several hundred bucks on the Power Commander, I'd give serious thought to going with TuneECU. You're looking at about $20 for the cable and the software is free. I'm not sure what dyno shop in the bay area uses it, but I'd bet D'Ecosse could point you in the right direction. A couple of hours of dyno time and a good tuner can dial in a custom map for you - or at least the best of several 'off the shelf' maps. All for maybe half the cost of the PC5 upgrade.

That's sort of having your cake and eating it too. You can pick up some power to teach your HD riding friend a thing or two, and save money to put toward that Storm you've got your eye on.
 
1 - 20 of 95 Posts
Top