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Discussion Starter #1
The History.
For the past year, in preparation for a restoration, I have read the many threads in this “superior Classic and Vintage” forum of this site. I do thank all of you for your knowledge and willingness to assist the newer comrades in the undertaking of their projects. The documentation of your projects is excellent and I commend all of you on your restoration works of art. Now it is my turn to actually dive in with my project as a newbie, though I am a bit intimidated by your restoration masterpieces. (no, I’m not just brown nosing) I willingly accept all critiques, criticisms, and unsolicited recommendations regarding my project.

This is a new adventure for me of tackling a fine Classic British product. My previous bike experience was only Japanese. This project, a 1971 T120RV will actually be my number two Triumph. My first one, still collecting parts, is a 1956 T110 rolling basket case I purchased in February 2011, which will be on temporary hold while I work on the recently purchased T120.

This fine machine, matching numbers, was found a short jaunt from my local area in which I spent $400 to be the proud owner. The gentleman I purchased it from found it in a trash heap he was hired to haul away to the dump. He didn't have any desire to work on it since he was a Harley Davidson guy. At least he had the foresight to keep it and didn’t take it to the dump. In spite of the many years of exterior exposure in a trash heap, this bike looks relatively new compared to some of the before pictures of projects I have seen on this site. My goal is to rebuild it as close to original as I am able, with a few slight mods. I’m not trying to build a showpiece, though I hope it will be a good looking, nice riding, well functioning machine.

Before a wrench was turned, these are the before pictures; after the initial cleaning of the mud and large chunks of debris and the removal of a few black widows emerging from the bowels within.






 

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Discussion Starter #2
A couple of nice mods from a previous owner. One, was the clever use of some garden hose and a finish nail for the fuel tank/mount stabilization.





Another was the use of two 1/2 inch galvanized pipe couplings for the “Metalastic Bushing” for the handlebar eyebolt. The rear fender was cut short, and the original tail light mount with the addition of an extra large Honda lens was mounted well forward. Finally, a generous usage of a rattle can satin black….rims, hubs, chrome fenders, handlebars, etc..






 

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Discussion Starter #6
David, thanks for the encouragement. I am thoroughly looking forward to this adventure. I have admired your project from afar. Well done!!

Paul, Most improved for 2013? I should have started last year!
Paul, you had mentioned to weld the frame near the swing arm spindle area whether cracked or not. The area I would be aiming at with the welder is within the box in the photo. Is this the correct area you were referring to?





A few questions for the experts.
On the front frame two down tubes abeam the “barrel to case” location, welded on are two small pieces of steel. I have viewed numerous pictures/manuals and have not seen any other bikes with this “unique” feature. I cannot determine what they are for other than a high "easy rider" foot peg bar in which may have been added by a previous owner. Does anyone by chance know what these are for? If they are of no significant purpose, I will just cut them off. Also, near the same location just below these two pieces of steel, the down tubes are a bit dented on both tubes. Any recommendations on the repair of the dents other than fill with a weld and grind them back into shape?




On the top tube portion of the frame, there was a poor weld at the front of the frame top tube. I could not determine if someone had tried to change the rake of the front end a little bit by cutting out a small section or if it was just a repair. The frame pictures I have looked at, the top tube has been straight up to the head tube. As you can see in the photo, this top tube has a small bend at the weld in which seemed a little odd, but I could not see any other bends/welds in any other parts of the frame necessary to counteract that upper bend. Any comments or recommendations other than clean up and re-weld? Thanks for your assistance.




 

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I think the frame is repairable.They're only welded together in the first place,and it's not exotic steel.
For the top tube to be bent,there must also be some bending of the front downtubes,relative to the steering head.Some measurements might be necessary,to work out where they did it.
The flat blocks can come off the downtubes.
I wouldn't weld up the crush marks.Just use filler and avoid distortion.I know other parts are already distorted;less is always better.
 

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Jpj441,
Mr Pete is a very knowlegeable and clever guy, so if he thinks it is repairable, then he probably has the experience of repairing something worse and it has worked out ok.
That said, Mr Pete has access to people whom he can trust (or he does it himself) and what facilities (or access to experts) that you have, is an unknown. The quality of the repair may then not be up to the standard that Mr Pete would find acceptable on a bike capable of over 100 mph.
He is undoubtably correct in that the down tubes will have been altered in some way to get some kind of rake. There are correct ways of doing this that results in a safe job. Looking at the spine, I would think that the down-tube slugs have been bodged too.

There are repairs that could be made to the frame. I would sleeve the spine internally and pin it prior to welding the cut. Maybe even an external sleeve too for safety? The down-tube slugs would have to be cut out and new fully internal slugs machined and pinned/welded into place.
However, and I know everyone would ideally like a matching numbers bike, unless you have access to someone who REALLY knows what they are doing, get a new frame. It may even be cheaper than patching the existing one.

Mark
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thank you Mark and Mr. Pete for your helpful advice, it is very much appreciated. Looks like another one of those unknowns that get discovered during a rebuild. After I remove the paint from the spine and down tubes and get a good look at what is hidden under the paint, I will figure out what will be the safest course of action with your recommendations.
John
 

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I couldn't see from your first photo that the frame is indeed chopped.

I'm more in the "it's trashed" crowd on this one. Oily frames are relatively inxpensive. only value (limited) would be in repairing your frame IF it is a numbers-matching deal and that would mean anything at all to you. In Texas, it's easy enough to get a rebuilt title with proper paperwork on purchase of the engine and replacement frame.

You've spotted the right area for the swingarm support welding, google "Big D motorcycle" and i believe you can see some of thier racing frame mods that you want to do whether it's this frame or another.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yesterday I pulled the engine and sandblasted the front end of the frame to see what mods were hidden under the paint. It didn’t look very good. The down tubes had about a three inch piece poorly scabbed into each of them and the steering head side brackets had also been modified. The mod at the steering head is what countered the bend mod on the spine. As of now, I’m not sure what the next plan of action will be for this frame.


While traveling through Reno, NV, I again stopped by a great Triumph shop, Ace Cycle, to check if he had acquired any parts for either of my machines. In the shop, Nickolas, the owner, was just getting ready to strip down a 1971 OIF to build it into a chopper for a client. What luck, better than in the Reno Casinos. I scored on many of the big parts I needed: front fender, rear fender with tail light, number plate brackets and grab rail, speedometer and tach with both mounting brackets, right foot rest, headlamp (with lens) and brackets, and handlebars all at a very fair “swap meet” price. At this point in time, I am just short of a petrol tank, seat, and chainguard to finish off the big pieces.

 

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I don't know what the general feeling is on re-stamping a different frame but I'd be tempted to source another frame and transfer the original number to it. Then destroy the original.

Triumph used to seel unstamped frames for this reason. Someone I know built an unstamped bike after the factory shut
 

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Discussion Starter #16
A question for the experts.
While working up my parts list, I pulled off the rear brake anchor plate to see if I would need to replace the rear brake shoes. The shoes and brake drum were covered with grease, hence new shoes. During the inspection, I could not see any type of seal between the bearing and the brake shoe area. The only grease retainers I could see was the felt ring on the speedometer drive gearbox and the R.H. grease retainer on the opposite side of the hub. I checked the parts manual and workshop manual and did not see any type of grease retainer on the brake drum side of the hub.

The portion of the brake anchor plate that inserts into the locking ring does not appear to be an adequate seal to prevent the intrusion of grease into the brake drum. Possibly the PO over greased or too light weight of grease for a wheel bearing? Some guidance would be appreciated.
Thanks, John
 

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Boil the brake shoes in soapy water to remove any oil/grease. Fit rubber sealed wheel bearings with C3 internal clearance.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Thank you Mr. Pete! The issue resolved and saved a few bucks all in two short sentences! That is very much appreciated!
John
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Throughout this past year, after first joining this elite group in February of 2011, while reading the various threads of the "Classic and Vintage" forum, it was quite apparent there are many knowledgeable individuals on this site from various regions of the globe generously willing to assist others.

After posting the pictures of my "modified" chopped and dented frame, and contemplating how to repair it with the suggestions of Mr. Pete and Mark61120, another one of the fine Gents from this site sent me a PM saying that he may be of some assistance for my repair problem. He had a straight OIF that needed a couple of minor welding repairs and with his frame and parts from my bent frame, I should be able to make one good useable frame for my bike. To top it off, his offer included, if I would pay for the shipping, he would send it my way, no charge for the frame! I can't thank him enough for his generous act!

Thank you Kevin (kjflick)! Your noble offer is very much appreciated! I hope to pass on your kindness to another member of this great group.

John
 
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