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Discussion Starter #1
14-November-2012- IMPORTANT NOTE:

Attention !! The following models are factory equipped with an anti-tamper system:

  • Triumph Tiger Explorer, all models
  • new Triumph Trophy, all models
  • new Triumph Street Triple from model 2013 and upwards
Never connect TuneECU with these models

BR, Tom
 

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Seems crazy, I wouldn't buy a bike I couldn't retune, since I discovered Tune ECU. If they go that way with all models, I won't be buying any new Triumphs.
 

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Seems crazy, I wouldn't buy a bike I couldn't retune, since I discovered Tune ECU. If they go that way with all models, I won't be buying any new Triumphs.
All the new feature means is that for all intents and purposes, the Triumph ECU will be tamperproof as far as TuneECU/Tuneboy is concerned. I presume this was added to protect the manufacturer in terms of its warranty.

While it is unfortunate, all that this will do will be to place all new Triumph owners in the same situation as Yamaha, Honda, Kawasaki , Suzuki, and I would even think HD owners! As with all these marques (and others?), the new Triumph lock-out feature will not prevent the use of a Power Commander and other aftermarket fueling/ignition module add-ons. Indeed, an earlier factory instruction seemed to allow for these modules to be added in terms of their warranty. I am presuming that this is still the case? In any case, their use will not cause the ECU to shut down and only be re-operable by direct intervention of the factory.

 

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Can you clarify Tom - does it simply not work, or work but records that the Tune has been modified, thereby invalidating potential engine warranty claims?
I've read the Factory's statement over and over again and it seems to say that the ECU will somehow record the use of a non-approved map and snitch on you...

The third paragraph of the original notice seems to say so:

 

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I suspect that the security could simply be a checksum match or non-match of authorized tunes. Whether a non-match would trigger more than just the stated logging ... Like an operation shutdown or lockout is the question. If it is just logging of modified tunes then that won't hinder unless you want a warranty.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The document is known, only it makes no exact information about what happens, except for the log function,
when you load with an unauthorized tool, something to the ECU (ECM / CDI).

Neither DTC (P1604: ECM tamper detected - return to Triumph), nor the constantly lit MIL is mentioned.

Also information missing, if only the diagnosis function is used by a non-Triumph tool. E.G. the dealer tool, which is used in many workshops.

Or have I overlooked something?

BR, Tom
 

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The document is known, only it makes no exact information about what happens, except for the log function,
when you load with an unauthorized tool, something to the ECU (ECM / CDI).

Or have I overlooked something?

BR, Tom
No matter how you enter the waveform, she still is math'd to produce the analog back out. If you look at the way I see it, the map is made like a rubik's cube. Every color is a map to chase. Meaning, each color is ROM (read only this memory) or lookup table.

If you toggle from 1 to 5, 5 being rich, 1 being lean, you still have to be within the color or the ROM tables, right? 5 colors is still the ECU is forced to read the ROM to compute. So if the rev limiter is still written in the ECU, it is still safe to use. Get it?

It seems to say, "We see you extended the rpm, and now claim a bent valve sort of scenario?" 'We also see a poor driveability map change, and you now want a new set of spark plugs?' 'Oh, look at that! You set so many codes, WATT were you thinking!".... [Under warranty!]

In bulletin speak = Warranty Denied; "Before you [the dealer] make a claim to us, download the ECU for fault codes.' 'Since there are no codes present, but a fuel map is being monitored by the DAC [chip on the motherboard is the final call to the ign/fuel]... 'You are in big trouble now, Spanky!' 'You may now charge the customer for (diagnosing) tampering under warranty, and a new [set] of plugs, plus installation.' 'We are just bean counters covering our butts on our end and can tell what you've been doing."

There are two ROM settings:

1. Normal running = ROM is reading under analog is the X factor.
2. Backup Mode = ROM still reads those limp lookup tables, which the Y factor still computes with.
3. Bike is safe to run either way = Final [factor] Z bike keeps running in either FULL Power or in Limp SAFE MODE.

Wink-WINK is WATT did I just explain in the generic?!! :assimilate
 

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Is Alain or you Tom working this out (or seeking a hack)?

On big asset that made me buying another triumph is tuneECU for sure. If I didn't have it I would have looked more on the BMW side. I bought a gt so I am ok for now

Fred
 

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My reading of the documentation, plus sensible implementation, is that changing a Map (including parameters such as rev limit) would flag a "tamper" but would not shutdown the ECU.

If it were a shutdown scenario then there'd be a fair few Daytona 675 racers that would not be happy to have that flexibility taken away.

Yes, I understand Triumph's legitimacy in protecting the terms of warranty provision. No, I would see no point in killing an ECU if a tamper flag is tripped.

The liability rests with the owner for changes outside the control of the factory.

That's acceptable to me (waive engine failure warranty where attributable to ECU tampering).

What would not be acceptable, for example, is refusing warranty on any other aspect of the bike (even engine) if tamper flag is tripped. eg. faulty casting, oil leak, faulty cam tensioner.
 

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What i want to know is, is the dealer, with the new 2013 bike, could change the map in the ECU if i want to change the stock muffler for an aftermarket slipon for exemple?
 

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And there would be no warranty implications provided the dealer does it and it is a Triumph factory tune. (EDIT: Triumph have "aftermarket" tunes for generic exhausts. There are also the "Arrows" tunes which still may be more suitable for a non-Arrows pipe.)

If warranty was otherwise not a concern, or was out of warranty period, then I'm presuming (from what has corresponded so far) that there is NO TECHNICAL REASON why TuneECU could not connect to and change a map.

ie. TuneECU won't "kill" the ECU, it'll just flag in the ECU that it's been fiddled with by a non-Triumph tool....no biggy.
 
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