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Discussion Starter #1
I am somewhat confused by HD's new XR1200. Who is the target audience?
The performance numbers (as tested by BIKE magazine October 2008) are really poor.
Performance :
As measured by BIKE magazine:
HD XR1200
0-60 -4.34 s

1/4 mile - 13.11 @ 103.9 mph

Measured HP - 90.1 @ 6900rpm

Meanwhile the Moto Guzzi Griso 8V,

0-60 3.38s

1/4 mile - 11.76 @ 117.5 mph

Measured HP - 97.5 @ 7300rpm.

BMW R1200R was comparable to the Guzzi.

Looking at the dyno charts shows the XR1200 mill hitting the rev limiter BEFORE peak hp or torque is reached. HD sure has lot of faith in their engine. Geez, let the darn thing rev a little.
Meanwhile, Motorcyclist's infamous HD XL1200R vs Triumph Thruxton comparison from a few years ago:
HD XL1200R
Corrected 1/4-mile* 13.02 sec. @100.03 mph 0-60 mph* 4.66 sec.
Triumph Thruxton 900:
Corrected 1/4-mile*13.26 sec. @ 99.99 mph 0-60 mph*4.99 sec.

SO who is this bike for? I don't think anybody will cross shop it with a BMW or MG, let alone a Ducati or anything from Japan Inc. If it is important that the bike be American, why not go for a Buell? Why didn't HD slot the Buell 1203 into the XR1200?

Sorry, I am confused.......
 

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Missed the Mark!

Well, all I can say is with the decline of flat racing in the US I suppose that Harley found it necessary to go to Europe. I know it pissed off alot of Harley racing fans and maybe they will change their minds. I know I'm going to kick myself for saying this but I like the style, not the engine mind you but the style of the modified racer. I believe it's being raced in Spain now in this configuration with the additiona of lights. Their series is home grown and I believe it covers several races at three different track venues. What is really neat, some of the races are at night, hence the lights. Would I buy one, maybe if it looked like this. Of course I'm a sucker for anything with road racing slicks. as I understand with minor airbox changes, modified ECU and the Termignoni Exhaust it will produce 100hp quite easily. Infact they have restricted it to the 100hp in Spain. Harley engine are not known for higher rpms. They have enough trouble keeping them togather at 6900-7000 rpm. Pushrods and a really poor degree V is also a hinderance for compactness. would I get rid of my R1200S for it................NO no in a million years. Would I take it over a MotoGuzzi ..............No not in a thousand. It has appeal but not so that I would run out an buy on if Harley sold it state side. That's probally why it's in Europe instead of here. Some said it was the dollar devaluation that did it. I say it was the appeal and being able to create a quicker following. All you have to do is look at the the new Buell and see it's poor rating by cunsumers to figure that on out. I owned one for about three months and after I found out that it wouldn't run smooth at crusing speeds and it was literally cooking itself to death, sold it as quick as I could. I'm still getting warranty updates bulletins each month on it. The Rotax motor is a really good one but leave it to Harley/Buell to screw it up.







But at 551lbs it's going to be a slug without a really good weight loss program. now put an 883 in it and put it in the Trial-ey Cup and they might just have something to race but the weight will kill it. Maybe this is what Harley's leaning towards with the Transatlantic Challenge. Other than that it's..........slow. It is fuel injected! That's a step towards the future for Harley.........maybe!

Cheers
Jeff:motorbike2:
 

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Ouch at $11,079, $12, 500.00 out the door. Why do they alway do this? It's beyond me. Wow, only 750 U.S.-market XR1200s. Maybe, as shown above but not the way they offer it. Looks like major reluctance on Harleys part. I agree with you on Merts Bikes.

Cheers

Jeff:motorbike2:
 

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I agree, maybe the retro crowd but it looks like it would scrape pretty easily IMO.



Why you would design a heavy, large, underpowered bike I don't know. Oh! we are talking about HD's though aren't we!

The test rider looks as though he is trying to get the most out of it, or, racing to the local public toilets. :)
 

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:goodpost:
He does look like his got to go the toilet though.:laughhard: Maybe it's because his dreading trying to get it back upright or it could be just before the pipes touch down, jack the rear wheel off the ground and wrecked. You notice the ducking of the head, as it indicates the preverbal "Oh SH%t"! I'll bet that's just what he's saying and thinking, let me get off this thing before I kill myself!:eek:

Cheers
Jeff:motorbike2:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
People who put image above the other motorcycle purchasing factors.
I was really hoping you weren't going to say that. I know it already though. It is too bad HD can't/won't build a bike that isn't based on image. A bike built for technical reasons....imagine that!



Ahhhhhh.........it would never sell.
 

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That bike looks seriously fun to me. Put some high pipes and some knobbies on it, and I'd be Jay Springsteen. :D

As to why HD hasn't sold these in the US, walk in to an HD dealership and ask them why the VRSCR didn't sell. Harley built their success on a culture of "traditional motorsickles", narrowly defined by their fans. The conversation in the US Harley dealerships would be mostly about what's wrong with this bike, not what's cool.

It's probably cool as hell to ride. Specs don't always tell the whole story.

Then again, I ride a Scrambler..... :p
 

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To me it looks like a special edition sportsster. And I agree with Hogwylde it does look a little gay. It seems like the regular 1200 sportster with aftermarket add ons would be better, faster...
 

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Not everone wants to go 212 mph (I don't know what that means in kph).

Some people want to get on a bike that they think looks nice/neat/bad/quick and get out and ride.

I certainly didn't buy my S3 because I thought it was ugly!

Few people buy a Harley for performance. If they do, they are either inexperienced or disappointed. Unless they compare it to similar bikes (other sportsters) and enjoy it.

And I think it looks pretty neat, for a Harley.

Ditto
 

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To me it looks like a special edition sportsster. And I agree with Hogwylde it does look a little gay. It seems like the regular 1200 sportster with aftermarket add ons would be better, faster...
Sal, I think Hog was taking the piss since he owns a HD and not a Triumph but I agree with you none the less.:D

Cheers

Jeff:motorbike2:
 

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Not everone wants to go 212 mph (I don't know what that means in kph)...............Ditto
Then explain why so many aftermarket engine build up, carb upgrade and exhausts kits are sold for Harley's than any other accessory.;) They aren't putting them on just because there cool. Most find that after twisting the throttle to full stop a couple of times that the bike falls far short of their performance expectations and want the kick that the bike won't provide in stock form.

It doesn't look bad but it's not a great diversion from anything that Harley's already done in the past. They are still trying to emulate the XR750 again, like they done several time in the past. Performance wise, it's still lacking without major modifications. I suppose that in it's present performance offering, it would make a good boat anchor.:D Now, had they have dropped the weight by 100lbs and used the Porsche designed V Rod or the Rotax motor that Buell is presently using, they might actually be on to something.

Cheers
Jeff:motorbike2:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Quite the dilemma.

Jealousy is a strong emotion. Some day you too will move up to a Triumph....

But seriouslly, as a HD owner, who do you see as the target market for the XR1200?
 

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I owned a sportster before I bought my Sprint and I loved it. Granted it was a first bike, but it was just lots of fun to ride. I was planning on upping the engine and putting some clip ons to give it a little bit extra but never got around to it. A LOT of Harley owners would buy these, if I was in the market I would too.

Remember the market HD is aiming for. There are plenty of older guys that want something a little more sporty to ride but a Buell, or any other sportbike, is just too much. The XR is old school while still being new and fresh. I love it.
 

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Jealousy is a strong emotion. Some day you too will move up to a Triumph....

But seriouslly, as a HD owner, who do you see as the target market for the XR1200?
Glad to see some forum members here not taking offense to some friendly ribbing. And I'll get a Bonnie yet....

But to answer your question, I believe it may attract new riders to the HD market but it will definitely attract current Sportster riders.
 
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