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Charging Voltage

13K views 36 replies 14 participants last post by  Tribry 
#1 ·
Hi, I did check out the sticky file on electrickery etc, but as I had to charge the battery again recently. Thought I would present this issue to the crowd. I'm sure someone knows whats going on. Perhaps this is normal?

Symptom, Charging seems to be mostly OK at idle and can reach 14V just above idle, but as the revs rise the charging voltage drops into what I think is the poor range ~ 12.5V

Check out the video
https://youtu.be/GEc54fnPpYc
 
#4 ·
Interestingly, your favorite RR155 on the Electrex site shows "catalog suspended"..., so I guess I'm screwed if mine ever packs it in... :(
 
#5 ·
Thank you - thought it looked suspicious - and explains why I was getting a flat battery even after running the bike.
In the threads i was looking at the yamaha seemed a favorite replacement, although the wiring could be a bit of a challenge.

OK, more searching. - 5 wire regulator rectifier :)
 
#11 ·
I agree, they have one crimp and go kit for $128.95 and a kit for Triumph triples for $114.95 that can be cut and crimped or soldered to the twins. The good thing about this route is once it's wired up you can use a Shindengen FA020AA or SH847 R/R. Or in case your traveling and need a replacement and are three states away from one of the few Triumph dealers one can be found at a near by Indian, Harley, Polaris, Yamaha or other dealer with the same wiring terminals, plug and go.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Hmmmm.... Over $200 for genuine Triumph part that will fail again OR (amazon links below)...

This one for $43 ? Is 50Amps going to be enough? 350W/13V = 27A That should fry any battery or wire harness

Or this one for $73. It has a name Triumph and Ducati attached to it, which makes it worth much more.

Now I have to consider if they are knock-offs or what???

I Imagine you just tie the extra reds together (bonnie black with red stripe wire) and blacks together (bonnie black with white stripe-ground) to get it back to 5 wires. Does it matter how the yellows are connected to the Triumph black wires?

Another fun project - still haven't finished the oil cooler lines yet (found some hose, but clamps I'm not happy yet)
 
#13 ·
That Ricks regulator looks like a good option - thanks for the heads up (why couldn't I find that on the Bella Corse site? - I did take a quick look, but clearly that wasn't enough)

I see Rick is also starting a line of regulators that work with LiFePO4 batteries. I'm asking him a question (via youtube) to see if his current model will work with a voltage sensitive LiFePO4 battery. I'll probably need to change to that battery in about a year.

The LiFePO4 in my FZ is now 2 years old this month and is doing great. Sits for at least a month with no trickle charging and then fires up just fine, can't say that for any of the lead acids I've had (bikes or cars) I'm beginning to become a convert to the new tech. The yamaha charges at 14.25V pretty consistantly at all rpms, so I think it will work
 
#15 ·
The LiFePO4 in my FZ is now 2 years old this month and is doing great. Sits for at least a month with no trickle charging and then fires up just fine, can't say that for any of the lead acids I've had (bikes or cars) I'm beginning to become a convert to the new tech.
I have the above-mentioned Rick's R/R in my bike and the stock Yuasa YTX12-BS battery. The current battery is about three years old. It doesn't need trickle charging for the five months it sits every winter. A good lead-acid battery that is properly charged by the vehicle charging system will hold its charge a long time, certainly for a month.

The new batteries are over-rated. People get them and then complain here about problems with them. Most of our forum members' lead-acid "battery problems" (myself included) have been charging system problems, current leakage problems, and old or cheap batteries.
 
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#14 ·
Beware of cheap knockoffs. Seems like I've seen a few posts recently about cheap ebay ones causing problems, like over-voltage. Which sucks more than under-voltage. One guy around here somewhere noticed his battery was smoking after a ride and wondered if that was a bad sign ... I'd want @Forchetto to confirm, but I think smoking batteries are typically not a good sign :)
 
#16 ·
One guy around here somewhere noticed his battery was smoking after a ride and wondered if that was a bad sign ... I'd want @Forchetto to confirm, but I think smoking batteries are typically not a good sign :)
Boeing seems to think that smoking batteries in the 787 are not good.
 
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#18 · (Edited)
I did get a reply from Ricks Electrics and he stated his 10_004H regulator is set for 14.5V +/- 0.2V

He is developing a new series of regulators specifically for the LiFePO4 battery from Ballistic. Their batteries have a max voltage of 14.4V, so i assume he will be setting the cut-off voltage at 14.2V for that battery and that would be safe for the other batteries too?
Checking on a couple of other brands I see that Kinetic says 14.6V max and Battery Tender (deltran) says 14.8Vmax

So if I get ricks electric regulator it will work fine with the lead acid until it croaks, then I can switch to a battery tender battery with no issues.

I wonder what the standard charging voltage is for vehicles, or if there is one???
 
#20 ·
Solution:
Replacing the regulator worked.
If you are snowed in, watching the 7 minute video might get your minds off of the endless nor'easters. in the states.
If you are having battery going flat issues, check out the first 30 seconds of the video.
If not, go out and ride.

https://youtu.be/RiYmHiP2C98

Oddly, when I was taking a test ride, it did seem to run better - extra voltage to the coil??? who knows.

Now I can get on with the oil cooler line replacements - I think I have a solution, but I need to run the bike a bit longer to confirm the clamps I picked worked - a little unconventional
 
#21 ·
My 2010 Thruxton had a failing voltage regulator, I was always coming back from a ride with a low battery. Having a voltmeter mounted on the bike is handy! This weekend I finally installed a Mosfet unit. Charge voltage now holds a steady 14.35 volts from idle on up. Placed the new regulator under the battery tray so wires are nice and short. I had previously removed the airbox so there was lots of room. Used the Super Mosfet Kit from Roadstercycle and the wiring bit was super easy, a cut splice, shrink wrap, and then added some plastic conduit for an extra layer of abrasion resistance. Mounting the unit and general cleanup took a bit longer.
 
#22 ·
Yes, I have a neat LED voltmeter wired in on my Thruxton. I originally bought one for my RE Classic as they have known issues with failing reg/rectifiers ( many bikes do these days). I was so impressed with it I bought another for my Triumph. At least I should get a warning before the battery fries or goes flat.
 
#23 ·
Well, the battery couldn't stand the strain of not being charged properly for who knows how long, so it gave up the ghost Monday. 12.22V, rapid clicking... I know what that means...

Just ordered a new Deltran (Battery Tender) BTL14A240C from Remy Battery in Wisconsin. The one in my FZ-09 is still going great after 2 years, so I will soon have a second "test" unit running. I will try and remember to take a video of the install as I will no doubt be cutting up spacers to take up the room vacated by the lead acid lump, compared to the new tiny battery. Just in case someone else decides to make the leap of faith.

I did chat with battery tender and they said their batteries are 4 cell units, which is excellent for long life, per this website. http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries < <-- If you have a laptop, you should read this!!

So I think it will work and their battery has a 14.8V max recommended charge voltage and the 14.5V max that the new Ricks Regulator puts out will be fine. This is the future we need, not self driving cars that kill people.
 
#24 ·
Battery installed and running fine again - I do weigh the old lead acid battery and compare it to the new Lifepo4 battery. The new lithium battery charger stops charging at just over 13.5V. Interesting.

See notes under the video for links if you are interested - its about 8 minutes and I had to do a subtle blanking of the bikes number plate at the end - see if you can spot it
https://youtu.be/0o_ISE-romw
 
#25 · (Edited)
Hi everyone.

I'm on a 2001 Bonneville. At the end of last season, after a day's riding on a cool night, I tried to start my bike. It wouldn't start and the headlights were dead, no horn. I jump started the bike and rode home. Problem recurred frequently -- I got rid of the battery which was probably 2+ years old.

I replaced it with a Shorai battery and the bike starts right up nicely every time but when I check my voltage I get the following readings :
Resting Voltage = 13.25 (all things off)
Running / Revving voltage = 13.6 to 13.8 ish. I don't get the 14+ V people speak of.

I'm going to check wires, battery connections, open the headlight to check the harness for the R/R. Could the mostly likely culprit be the R/R--mine is likely the original from my twin carbed 2001. It's now 2019.

I am going to post this here and in another area (rule breaking) just because this thread is a bit old. hope to get feedback. Thanks .
 
#26 ·
I'm going to check wires, battery connections, open the headlight to check the harness for the R/R.

Check also the connector that joins the alternator stator to the wiring loom, follow the thicker cable that comes out of the triangular engine cover until you reach the connector. Finding it melted or with clear signs of overheating is far from uncommon, not just on the Bonnie, but on many Triumphs.









 
#27 ·
HI Forchetto,

I'm on a 2001 Bonneville with what looks to be the original Regulator Rectifier. I just installed a Shorai battery. My voltage readings are --resting voltage on battery 13.25 and running voltage, bike at fast idle or revving 13.5 to 13.8

Should I swap out the old R/R for one of these new one's everyone's talking about to get 14.4 volts?
My biggest concern lately is for cold starts--days below 50 F. Also will there be some performance enhancement with a newer R/R?

I'm just worried that my R/R only gets 13.5 to 13.8--is that the top on the older RR unit.

Very best to you from USA Massachusetts.
 
#30 ·
Thanks I'll take a deep look for that...wiring harness burn or heat damage.

Forchetto, what was the voltage performance on stock Regulator Rectifiers. Was the charging at a top of 13.8?
or did stock Regulator Rectifiers (at least for the 2001) go above 13.8.

Best to you!

Stock regulator should be set at 14.3 to 14.5 or so. This is normal charging voltage level on vehicles and its what's required to fully charge-up lead acid batteries used cyclically as in vehicles and traction applications.

For stuff such as UPS or alarm systems (standby use) 13.5 or 13.8 Volts are recommended to maintain them charged, and it's a compromise between smaller depth of charge but a longer service life.
 
#31 ·
I measured with a multimeter but do not remember what the actual numbers were.
The way I initially detected the problem was that I have one of those multi colored LED volt meters that read red, yellow, or green installed.
The meter was showing mostly yellow with some red and occasionally blinking into green. I then checked the charging current as per the manual and it was low.
 
#32 ·
It sounds like my stock regulator is definitely under performing if it's only reaching 13.8. I think I'm just going to replace and go MoSfet. I must go back into the forums now to find which R/R is the closest to swap old one out, plug new one in. I'm not bad at crimping but I'd prefer to just plug and pray.

Best to you!
 
#33 ·
It sounds like my stock regulator is definitely under performing if it's only reaching 13.8. I think I'm just going to replace and go MoSfet. I must go back into the forums now to find which R/R is the closest to swap old one out, plug new one in. I'm not bad at crimping but I'd prefer to just plug and pray.



Best to you!
Which R/R did you get? I'm also seeing voltage no higher than 13.8 or so even when I rev the bike to 4k RPM.
 
#34 ·
Many thanks again to this wonderful forum. I had the click, click,dead battery event. Knowing the battery was recently bought I assumed the regulator/rectifier had gone west. With the aid of this and another thread I was able to test the charging system with some sort of method. It lead me to double check the connections where I found one of the five pins of the reg/rec plug had failed, I missed it at first as the plug had a good coating of electric grease, but after a thorough clean it was clear that the brown wire connection had failed. After a clean up and reset I have the correct/normal readings from the multimeter across the battery.
Great stuff
 
#35 ·
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