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Discussion Starter #1
I put the 3 new exhaust shims in and for some reason I can't get the camshaft to seat correctly. The pics below show the issue. When I removed it this morning I matched up the = & - lines, and the wheel hasn't been touched since. I just can't see what may be holding it above it's correct position.

Thanks!
 

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It looks like the anti back lash gear and cam gear teeth aren't lined up. I would try using the pin you placed through the gears to line the teeth up better. Should drop right in.

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The backlash gear teeth look to still be out of alignment. Put some pressure on the bolt you have through the gear to get the teeth lined up. should slot home nicely then.
 

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The backlash gear teeth look to still be out of alignment. Put some pressure on the bolt you have through the gear to get the teeth lined up. should slot home nicely then.
Ok, that's just too freaky...

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Lol, 8 ball in the corner pocket! Thanks guys! Once I've got my nose buried in an issue I can't 'see' anything.......Next round on me!
 

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Discussion Starter #7
So how did it go LA ? Looking good and clean in there.
Thanks Neil, all good I think, but though all put together I didn't have time yet to seat the new shims in with a few tire rotations, then re-measure. Lastly I'll give the now dry top end an oil dribble from my wife's salad brush and on goes the valve cover til, well maybe several years!
 

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It might just be the photo but it looks like you have the cam mark lines one side and dot the other ?
How did you get on undoing those cam cap bolts ? Mine were a total PITA. !!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It might just be the photo but it looks like you have the cam mark lines one side and dot the other ?
How did you get on undoing those cam cap bolts ? Mine were a total PITA. !!

That line-up of =&- is from Propforward's thread: https://www.triumphrat.net/air-cooled-twins-technical-talk/96205-12000-mile-service-overview.html and is intended to be the easiest position, less pressure from the lobes, to remove the camshafts.

Cam cap torx bolts?? John Bloor's revenge! Wretched! Whack Heat Bang Twist Slip Gash Knuckle........I had to grind off the last 3 and only could break the bond and begin turning them with a punch when the head was ground to onion paper thin. Now, like yours, 12 black shiny M6 hex heads invite the 10mm socket for a 45min valve check next time.

It particularly cranks me because this is the second Bonnie I've done this to, and I'll likely be on the mantle in a jar before I own one that's already be done.
 

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LA - Couple questions for those of us that have never had the "pleasure" of doing this on our Triumphs.
How much shim change did it require to get to spec?
All the shims need adjustment or just a couple?
Would putting some heat, as in propane torch have helped ease the torque on those cap bolts before even attempting removal?

Well, I guess that was three questions...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I found good mini-torches at two stores but neither had the required fuel tanks, so I didn't try heat, though some recommend it. The Craftsman T30 held up well after heavy but unrewarding use of the 1/2" impact driver, and lastly I tried my small air driven rattle wrench, freeing one badly stuck.
So grinding the last 3 was the only solution.

Using cheapie standard shim blades, and even slight variations in lobe position can make for widely disparate measurements, considering all that, 3 were tight running from .254 very tight fit, to .229 no-go, after several tries at consistency.

The existing shims measured .284 .283 .284. The Triumph dealership calc'ed and sold me 3, all at .280 for $8 each, and that put all in mid-range. The valve check itself is quick n easy and worth it since the exhaust valves typically tighten, and at 30826 miles thought it was time for a second look.

Guessing you, with an engineering background would have fun getting some fairly true numbers - Enjoy
 

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Mmmm. I ordered some nice new bolts which were also black, however they were still the cursed Torx !! Swap ? LOL

I had a blow torch left over from my plumbing days, so I was able to get them nice and warm but I still ended up having to borrow a proper rattle gun and even then they put up a fight !!! I broke several Torx bits in my efforts.

Jon
 

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Well I guess we should look at it this way - Triumph wanted to make dang sure those cap bolts do not come loose while out riding. That would be a catastrophic failure for sure. Did they appear to have a locklite bond agent of any type on the threads?
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Well I guess we should look at it this way - Triumph wanted to make dang sure those cap bolts do not come loose while out riding. That would be a catastrophic failure for sure. Did they appear to have a locklite bond agent of any type on the threads?
Nope, no sign of loctite or other products either on the bolts with heads still intact, or on the cam caps. Likely as has been said, it's the thousands of heat cycles within an oily enviornment that does it. When I was at the dealer getting the shims I had the intense urge to pop up a valve cover from a new floor model to check if Triumph was still installing these Torx, but there were too many people around.........
 

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It's only the first time you remove those that they are so tight though. And they don't take that much torque when re-installed. It's not the heat cycles, mine have seen plenty and I've had them back out several times. They are easy-peasy to remove now, but that first time ... I used a fairly long breaker bar to get that job done.

I didn't see any loctite on mine either on that first removal, but something is different about the first install at the factory. Maybe it's those first heat cycles that expand the aluminum threads, but after that they stabilize? Just guessing ...


Those dowels sitting there while you work worry me, don't want those to be bumped out and fall into the motor. But I'm a worrier. I probably have 10 shop rags pushed into any orifice I can find when doing that job :)
 

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Discussion Starter #16
BB -Those dowels sitting there while you work worry me, don't want those to be bumped out and fall into the motor. But I'm a worrier. I probably have 10 shop rags pushed into any orifice I can find when doing that job.

I wondered if someone would mention that, even the pic scared me too thinking they might jump out somehow, but I actually had so many rags stuffed in there I couldn't get a good pic. No one ever said before that I know of, that they can be re-used, but I guess if they're removed with the heads still viable one could. Yes, 10nm is barely 'there' compared to most bolts.
 

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The manual says that on re-assembly the threads should be lubed with oil. Definitely no sign of thread lock or anything else. Perhaps that's the difference - when first assembled the bolts were dry ? It does seem as though some people have more trouble than others, so who knows.
10Nm is barely wrist tight!
 

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I used a good quality torx bit (essential) and a breaker bar
Put pressure on the socket end and lever slowly
This was my strategy too, and I muttered 'thank god' each time the screw came free without the torx bit jumping out. I tried a hand-held impact wrench, but as far as I can tell that thing is useless. I has not freed a single screw for me since I bought it. Either I don't know how to use it or it's just a novelty item sold to suckers like me.

IMG_20110213_182445.jpg
 

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Those impact tools require a SERIOUS hard wack - Held as tight as you can down into the head of the screw or bolt and really lay into it with a large heavy hammer. You really have to lay into them to get it to ratchet and break the screw loose.
I hate the tool - but it has worked for me a couple times over the 45 years I have owned it.
I hate having to pound on something to get to work. Not how I like to work on things.
 
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