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I note the Royal Enfield 650 has a little wire heat shield on the corner of the cylinder heads. It just clips in place. I think a lot of people remove them. Perhaps you could get something similar made up for your bike
Yes, just like these Triumph part numbers.
T1150069 and T1150072 are 'Heat Bars', used on some models, looks like they push between the fins. Might work for you.
 
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Either your leg is in contact with the cylinder/cylinder head or there's a major issue with the left cylinder to give you the "deep" burn you describe. I agree with the suggestion to measure the temp of both cylinder heads. If the left if hotter the problem could very well be a bad 02 sensor causing a lean running condition in that cylinder.

Did the dealer measure temperatures or did he just pat you on the head and tell you 'they all do that'?

Paul
 
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Discussion Starter #23 (Edited)
Either your leg is in contact with the cylinder/cylinder head or there's a major issue with the left cylinder to give you the "deep" burn you describe. I agree with the suggestion to measure the temp of both cylinder heads. If the left if hotter the problem could very well be a bad 02 sensor causing a lean running condition in that cylinder.

Did the dealer measure temperatures or did he just pat you on the head and tell you 'they all do that'?

Paul
Unfortunately I have no clue about motorcycle mechanics and I rely on people who are experienced in that :). My dealer did not want take any time to look at me, or my riding position or doing any analyses. I only got the words that they don’t know any issue and that I might get an appointment in around 4 weeks. I asked another Triumph dealer, same answer but this time they even didn’t want to make an appointment with me and told me that the Twin is a great bike. I didn’t ask them to do it for freI am really disappointed of that bad service by Teiu

This forum helped me a lot to understand what the cause is.

Lyd
 

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I have a 2017 street twin and even before I did the decat it never got that hot, even in southern California in the summer. I have noticed it running a little cooler after the decat.
 

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For what it's worth I agree with @SPEED-TWIN-77 that its more likely your riding position rather than a bike issue.
Like he said I think you need to sit further back and if your arms aren't long enough change the bars.
Although those heat Shields/heat bars are definitely worth a go.
Hope you find a solution that means you can keep the bike.
 
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Unfortunately I have no clue about motorcycle mechanics and I rely on people who are experienced in that :). My dealer did not want take any time to look at me, or my riding position or doing any analyses. I only got the words that they don’t know any issue and that I might get an appointment in around 4 weeks. I asked another Triumph dealer, same answer but this time they even didn’t want to make an appointment with me and told me that the Twin is a great bike. I didn’t ask them to do it for freI am really disappointed of that bad service by Teiu

This forum helped me a lot to understand what the cause is.

Lyd
That's terrible customer service Lyd. Consider purchasing or borrowing a touch less thermometer and take reading of both cylinders near the area of your calf and see what you find then report back. That will also arm you with information to share with a dealer.

This issue it not about your riding position based on your earlier description of the burn.

Paul
 
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Discussion Starter #27
Lyd:

I found this image on Triumph's website of a lady rider on a Street Twin and I think I understand what you mean now. It looks like the rider's leg position is quite close to the cylinder head. That would be pretty warm! I cannot think of a practical solution to the issue though. Perhaps a different (fatter) foot peg to raise the knee up just a bit or thicker soled boots?

Noel

View attachment 731755
Thanks for searching that picture. I would say I am not far away from this position - and I attached also a picture of me.
Not sure if bringing the foot up might help but I will try it definitely to see where the cylinder heads might end up
Lyd
 

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For what it's worth I agree with @SPEED-TWIN-77 that its more likely your riding position rather than a bike issue.
Like he said I think you need to sit further back and if your arms aren't long enough change the bars.
Although those heat Shields/heat bars are definitely worth a go.
Hope you find a solution that means you can keep the bike.
I very much agree with this comment because I also think it is a problem of driving position.
The cylinder heads of our motorcycles are constantly hot (contact impossible) and in the event of a lack of coolant or oil, the engine would have had problems.
You may be squeezing the tank too much between your thighs, a tip often given by the pros to become one with the bike.
If you have short arms, you have to change the handlebars to be able to move back the riding position and relieve the pressure on the tank.
Temporarily, try to find well-fitting boots or make gaiters out of insulating material to put on before you go. A little restrictive but effective.
But keep this great bike!
( Google translate ????? )
 

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Discussion Starter #29
I very much agree with this comment because I also think it is a problem of driving position.
The cylinder heads of our motorcycles are constantly hot (contact impossible) and in the event of a lack of coolant or oil, the engine would have had problems.
You may be squeezing the tank too much between your thighs, a tip often given by the pros to become one with the bike.
If you have short arms, you have to change the handlebars to be able to move back the riding position and relieve the pressure on the tank.
Temporarily, try to find well-fitting boots or make gaiters out of insulating material to put on before you go. A little restrictive but effective.
But keep this great bike!
( Google translate ????? )
Thanks! Kevlar is already heat-resistant and additional gaiters, knee pads I tried. And it only delayed the burn :(
Lyd
 

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Lyd,

the responses here fall into a number of categories.

  • Riding position
  • Engine cooling problems
  • technical engine problems
  • Generic engine temperature issues
Let's run through those...

Riding position:

This may be the problem but likely only cause that level of burn if your leg is actually held in contact with the cylinder head or is exceptionally close for a sustained period.​
Could you please let us know if your left leg is in contact with the cylinder head when you are riding, and if not, how big the gap is?
As you have advised that only the left leg is affected, could you please let us know if your right leg is in contact with the cylinder head when you are riding and if not, how big the gap is?

Engine cooling problems:

Modern engines are remarkably robust, so can run for extended periods with little or no cooling or lubrication. It isn't good for them and can cause long term damage, but they can run like that for a surprisingly long time. They will, however run very hot.​
Could you please let us know if you have checked the oil level and it is at the right level?
Could you please let us know if you have checked the water and it is at the right level?

Technical engine problems:

The two cylinders should run at the same or very similar temperatures*. As your legs are likely the same distance from each head and you report that only the left is a problem, this might indicate an underlying engine problem that is leading to overheating on the left hand cylinder.Using a temperature sensor may help in at least confirming if there is a difference or not.​

Generic engine temperature issues:

If it transpires that the engine is running right, the cooling and lubrication are fine and there is an air gap between your legs and the heads, then a decat will reduce the overall heat soak around the engine, and a remap may also help a little, but neither will make much difference if you're in contact with the engine, the cooling or lubrication aren't working or there's a mechanical problem.​


* after I've had a cup of tea, I'm going out for a ride. I've dug out my laser temperature sensor and will check the cylinder heads near to the rear most head bolt - the point likely to be closest to the knee - on my return. As I have a Street Scrambler, whilst the engine is the same, the exhaust and catalyst routes to the right so there is a possibility that the right cylinder may be hotter than the left, but I expect the difference to be marginal.
 

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Discussion Starter #31
Could you please let us know if your left leg is in contact with the cylinder head when you are riding, and if not, how big the gap is?
I know I am closer to the cylinder head in stop and go situations.
My leg is not in contact in general. The gap might be around at least 5 cm - and when it’s getting especially hot there (I feel the difference as the real heat starts after riding more than half an hour), I lean my knee far away while riding, so the gap between cylinder head might be > 20 cm.
When it’s getting hotter, it feels like a pointed stream of heat hitting my leg.

Using a temperature sensor may help
I will definitely get one of these to check!

Thank you for such a structured answer!
Lyd
 

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I've been out for about 25 mins, up and down hills and riding briskly and the temps are pretty much identical.

Left: 75C

Right: 77C

I'll check again when I get home.

Oil?

Water?

 

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I've ridden back again.

Let hand cylinder head - 80C



Right hand cylinder head - 78C



Cat inlet - 202C



Cat outlet - 141C



Exhaust heat shield - 28C



My legs (as I mentioned before I've got little legs) are about 10cm from the cylinder heads when I'm riding. My right leg rests against the Scrambler's heat shield.

Whilst the measurements might not be spot on, the key things to note are that the cylinder head temperatures are similar left/right, and the presence of the catalytic converter isn't making the nearer head warmer than the other. It's possible, or even likely, that the bike will run cooler with no cat, but for now the key thing is left and right are similar.

For reference, my ride has been through rural Gloucestershire, not stop/start in the centre of a busy town, so the temps for me will be lower than in that circumstance.

Regarding your bike, I'll be a lot happier when I know it has coolant!
 

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My wife has a ST. She’s never had an issue with heat. She’s short, 5’2”. I need to look at where her leg is when she’s on the bike. I really can’t figure where you’d get a burn like on a ST. It’s got to be a riding position issue. Maybe post more pictures showing better detail of where your leg is making contact.
I’ve had a similar burn only once, from a crash when my bike was laying on my leg!
 

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When it’s getting hotter, it feels like a pointed stream of heat hitting my leg.
I find this an interesting statement and possibly the cause of the problem? Touching the cylinder head with your leg to produce a burn is not the same as a "pointed stream of heat", which makes me wonder if there's a leak somewhere, which the Triumph shop should be able to check, if they were willing to take it seriously.
 
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I am 5'4", so I think I fit the shorter rider category too. It's one of the reasons I switched to a Street Twin. I got sick of being on my tip toes all the time, but don't like low cruiser style bikes. Anyway, I was able to reproduce your problem by sliding as far forward as I could and pulling my legs in tight, but it was uncomfortable. I seem to sit a inch or two farther back from the tank, and that's all that's needed to clear the heads. You might want to try to adjust your position, and if your arms are to short to slide back a bit I agree that a different set of bars may be a good inexpensive solution. All the talk of de-catting and mechanical checks is technically correct, but I doubt any of it matters in your case, Heads are hot weather the cat is in place or the bike is running well or not. Royal Enfield had enough complaints like yours about the Interceptor 650 that they added the little heat bars to their cylinder heads as noted by others above. I test drove one before my Street Twin and my knees were always touching them, but most folks just discard them. They just slide between the cooling fins and stay put via friction. I wouldn't be surprised if you could use them on your Triumph, and I also bet that a dealer would have some laying around that they could give/sell you - although Royal Enfield dealerships are not found everywhere. Here's a picture of them - best I could find. Note the little black rectangular thingy on the upper left of the head. This might be the best (and cheapest) fix for you.

IMG_6262b_1600.JPG
 

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Another Interceptor 650 fin guard pic....


WhatsApp Image 20181215 4.jpeg.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #39
I am 5'4", so I think I fit the shorter rider category too. It's one of the reasons I switched to a Street Twin. I got sick of being on my tip toes all the time, but don't like low cruiser style bikes. Anyway, I was able to reproduce your problem by sliding as far forward as I could and pulling my legs in tight, but it was uncomfortable. I seem to sit a inch or two farther back from the tank, and that's all that's needed to clear the heads. You might want to try to adjust your position, and if your arms are to short to slide back a bit I agree that a different set of bars may be a good inexpensive solution. All the talk of de-catting and mechanical checks is technically correct, but I doubt any of it matters in your case, Heads are hot weather the cat is in place or the bike is running well or not. Royal Enfield had enough complaints like yours about the Interceptor 650 that they added the little heat bars to their cylinder heads as noted by others above. I test drove one before my Street Twin and my knees were always touching them, but most folks just discard them. They just slide between the cooling fins and stay put via friction. I wouldn't be surprised if you could use them on your Triumph, and I also bet that a dealer would have some laying around that they could give/sell you - although Royal Enfield dealerships are not found everywhere. Here's a picture of them - best I could find. Note the little black rectangular thingy on the upper left of the head. This might be the best (and cheapest) fix for you.

View attachment 731907
Thank you so much for your analyse. You tried to reproduce my issue, and you were successful- and this points clearly to an issue with my riding position. And I understood by the other feedbacks that I have to adjust my position - and get in case the heat bars to keep my bike.
Lyd
 

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I really do hope that the bike's fine!

Regards the Triumph and RE guards, they are designed for air cooled engines and rely on the fin spacing to hold them in place. I doubt they'll stay in place on a water cooled bike.
 
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