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Brilliant Stewart! Thank you for the clarifications. The two recent posts are very helpful. I'll refer to them as I move forward.

So I strongly advise against "the path of not employing the dip"; otoh, I strongly advise for connecting headlamp dip correctly;
To your point regarding connecting the dip, I will follow your advice for connecting it. I appreciate your perspective and its very rational.


In the left-most ('Off'') position, terminals #1 and #2 should have continuity, terminals #3 and #4 shouldn't have continuity, terminals #5 and #6 should have continuity, terminals #7 and #8 shouldn't have continuity.

In the middle position, terminals #1 and #2 shouldn't have continuity, terminals #3 and #4 should have continuity, terminals #5 and #6 still should have continuity, terminals #7 and #8 still shouldn't have continuity.

In the right-most position, terminals #1 and #2 shouldn't have continuity, terminals #3 and #4 still should have continuity, terminals #5 and #6 shouldn't have continuity, terminals #7 and #8 should have continuity.
I tested the Lucas ##34419 switch for continuity on all the positions and terminal combinations you specified, and all verified correct function according to what you wrote. That said, since I have it on-hand and shipment delays for a replacement #35710 switch could take several more weeks, I would greatly appreciate your guidance on connections using the #34419 switch.

could you remove the switch on the left-hand side of the shell and post some top, bottom, sides photos.?
For clarity, when referring to left-hand / right-hand, I assume that is from the direction of the rider on the seat. If so, left-hand side (rider's left) has a push-button switch marked as Lucas PS9 (on top) and 31620E (or perhaps, F can't tell for certain) with what I assume is a date stamp of 0370 just to the right of that.

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The the right-hand side (rider's right) is where the current rotary switch is located and showing numbers 31276B with date marking 2/71.

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Here is what I'm seeing in my parts manual, showing the lighting switch [10] designated for the rider's right side of the lamp and the dip switch [11] for the rider's left side. So from what I gather in your comment, the left-side dip switch in the headlamp is the correct part number, but obsolete as the dip switch is now controlled via the horn/dip combo at the left handlebar. Is that correct?

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I am getting a bit lost on this thread, but if you intend to use the "dip switch" that is in the headlamp shell, which is normally hit first to dip, then hit again to return to main beam, what I have heard is that they can be exciting?
Mountain Cubs had them and they soon got a reputation for plunging the rider into darkness which, combined with having a hand of the bars, proved an adrenaline experience.
 

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Hi Ronnie, The lens/reflectors are indeed hard to find for your bike. The bulb socket wire colors are what are often sold. No matter they work fine. I've used them on Bonnies.

I've not personally seen your new lens/reflector used with LED bulb so you'll be the one to tell us about the focus. The larger (Bonneville) size repro lens that has round Lucas logo in center focus fine with LED bulb. I have experience with those.

My '64 Mountain Tiger Cub has the small headlight with twist switch on right, push button high/low on left. Both worked reliably for me, but I didn't ride bike much. Needless to say reaching down to headlight to push button is a pain. Cub doesn't have beam indicator. If you have lever dip switch on left bar, I'd use that. Just leave the push button there for looks.

The twist switch I have & what you show in photo has no provision for pilot (parking) lights. My Cub has no parking light (or battery).

I don't know how much dip your new lens will provide/focus. But I agree hook up dip switch & high beam indicator. As I said it will default to high beam all the time even though indicator light works as it should with dip switch. I'd still leave it until you get the rest of wiring done. If you want diode you can make one or contact me off list & I'll see what we can do. 99% of LED bulb users don't even know there did isn't really doing anything, but we'll see in your case.

I made a chart of the BW bullets. You can identify them by the rings, shape of body & hole size at pointed end. Easy once you see it.

My '73 shop manual has wire gauge chart. I did some experimenting with BW bullets, 14 strand original Triumph wire & AWG wire. So far as I can measure 14 strand original is ISWG 18. This gauge is fatter than AWG 18. Yet thinner than AWG 16. So if all you can get is AWG you have to decide which to use 16 or 18. For larger consumers I chose 16. That's debatable of course. I could not find metric wire. I'm going to get some 14 strand BW & do further testing.

The reason you can't just go to auto parts store & buy 14 strand wire is it's not AWG. I've found in USA most of the sellers actually sell AWG sized wire passed off as metric or whatever. The actual diameter of strand wire AWG is larger than solid wire AWG. So you have to use strand wire gauge chart not solid wire chart... Most charts are for solid so don't let that throw you. I've been trying to buy metric wire. Even on Ebay I can't find it. So it seems British Wiring Products is our only go to source for correct strand/size wire in USA. They have correct colors also, which is nice.

In any case the good news is you can use either 16 or 18 AWG wire as well as 14 strand in C314 BW bullet.

I did some experiments with my Lucas crimper. I found I didn't need/want to go all the way until auto release. It can over crimp depending size of conductor. In every case, try to pull off bullet with fingers. Really hard pull. It must never pull off or crimp is too loose. If crimp wants to crack or bend bullet, crimp is too tight. Very little practice will get the feel for this.
Don
 

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Hi Dave,

"dip switch"
getting a bit lost on this thread,
Mmmm ... afaict:-

. '68 and early '69 TR25W had the same off/on ignition key switch and 3-position lighting switch (lamps-off/rear-'n'-pilot/rear-'n'-head) as all other contemporary Britbikes, but the 31620 push-button dipswitch mounted through the headlamp shell and just the 60-0994 horn button clamped around the 'bars;

. '70 and later '69 TR25W continued with the same ignition and lighting switches, but the parts books illustrate/list the Wipac 16714 Ducon combined horn-'n'-dipswitch cluster on the left 'bar (otherwise only fitted to pre-'71 Beesas); nevertheless, the earlier 31620 push-button dipswitch was still fitted but just not connected(?);

. '71-on had the same switches as all other '71 Triumphs and BSA's - 4-position ignition-and-lighting switch, 31276 headlamp-only on/off switch and 39595/6 handlebar switch clusters.

Otoh, Ronnie's bike, although it's a '70, is a collection of electrical bits - 4-position ignition-and-lighting switch (although his bike's has the later terminal 4), (currently) 31276 headlamp-only on/off switch, headlamp-mounted 31620 push-button dipswitch (not connected?) and pre-'71 Triumph-style 31563 horn-'n'-dipswitch screwed on the left 'bar ... 😵

Hth?

Regards,
 

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Hi Ronnie,

left-hand side (rider's left) has a push-button switch marked
31620
right-hand side (rider's right) is where the current rotary switch is located and showing numbers 31276
Then firstly, my apologies for inadvertently adding to the confusion in my post #60 ... 😩 31276 was used in '71 and '72 just to switch just the headlamp on/off, in conjunction with the 4-position ignition switch that's on your bike - the rider turned the ignition key fully-clockwise to energise the ignition and all lamps except the headlamp but including that rotary switch, then the rider turned the 31276 rotary switch as required just for the headlamp. However, your photos of your 31276 show it's missing the screws that secured the wires(?):-



the left-side dip switch in the headlamp is the correct part number, but obsolete as the dip switch is now controlled via the horn/dip combo at the left handlebar.
(y)

I would greatly appreciate your guidance on connections using the #34419 switch.
In your video you linked in your post #55, at 6:04, you show the end of a White/Brown wire with a female spade terminal; could you confirm whether the other end of this reappears near the oil pressure switch or at the ignition switch? For various reasons (which I can bore you with if you wish ;)), #34419 requires two separate power inputs and I'm trying to work out the easiest alterations to advise to your bike's wiring.

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Hi Don,

been trying to buy metric wire.
seems British Wiring Products is our only go to source for correct strand/size wire in USA.
Fwiw, I'll be highly-surprised if BW wire isn't metric - he's tied up with Autosparks in GB (British wiring - About Us) and uses the same part numbers as Autosparks for both wires and terminals, GB's been metric for decades.

experiments with my Lucas crimper.
try to pull off bullet with fingers.
Ime, not a good-enough test. Better is to push the crimped bullet into a new snap connector with the "bullet closing tool" and then pull it out again with the wire - new snap connector holds any bullet much tighter than fingers ever can.

Btw, I use a similar trick when I have to crimp a metric bullet on an older wire (so the interference-fit between bullet and wire isn't so good) and then push the bullet into a new snap connector. Then first I push an old Lucas machine-crimped bullet-'n'-wire into the new snap connector and pull it out again - that stretches the new snap connector a little, so it then doesn't grip the new-bullet-on-old-wire quite so tightly (but the connection's still tight long-term so no worries there). (y)

All that said, not sure Ronnie's posted where his bike's new harness came from? So I'm not sure the wire sizes it has?

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Hey Stuart,

However, your photos of your 31276 show it's missing the screws that secured the wires(
Good catch! I had no idea screws were intended for securing wire in that switch. I thought those were slots to connect bullets into. Yes, they indeed are absent of screws.

you show the end of a White/Brown wire with a female spade terminal; could you confirm whether the other end of this reappears near the oil pressure switch or at the ignition switch?
Certainly!I just checked again and the White/Brown wire only appears again at the ignition switch. Also, just in case it may have been missed, I added a new video link with the current state of the headlamp wiring in post #57 prior to pulling out the lighting and dip switch.

Additionally, going back through this whole thread I saw your post #36 to Ryan recommending adding a fuse to the +ve connecting red wire...

. For this reason, I always change the position of the single/main fuse on any '68-on non-electric-start bike. If the bike's harness has more than one Red (or '79-on Black) wires attached to the battery ring terminal, I cut of the ring terminal, terminate each wire with an individual bullet terminal and push them into a snap connector with a new 28-strand wire and blade fuse holder, the new wire becoming the only one connected to battery +ve (pre-'79, battery -ve '79-on).
Would you recommend I do the same? I do see my red wire to battery +ve does indeed have two wires connecting to a ring. If so, could you guide me on the type of blade fuse holder and fuse to use here. Also, would the mean I should keep or remove the fuse holder on the brown/blue -ve side wires?

Lastly, and perhaps you're already planning to mention it, but in regards to post #57 from @TR7RVMan wherein he suggests that to continue using the dip switch I need installing of a diode in the high-beam circuit:

Either leave it or you'll have to install diode in high beam circuit in a very specific location.
Would you recommend I do this too? I believe I'd need some deeper explanation into the type of diode to purchase and best practices in adding it in.


Looking forward to your continued guidance, and extended patience ;)
 

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All that said, not sure Ronnie's posted where his bike's new harness came from? So I'm not sure the wire sizes it has?
Sorry, I should've specified. I originally bought one from Classic British Spares but upon receiving it and finding the absence of the oil pressure switch wires, I returned it. I then went on the hunt to find one with the oil pressure switch wires, to no avail. I ended up purchasing the one from British Wiring specified for my model, which upon receiving I realized was identical in appearance to the first one I purchased from Classic British Spares. :unsure:
 

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Would you recommend I do the same? I do see my red wire to battery +ve does indeed have two wires connecting to a ring. If so, could you guide me on the type of blade fuse holder and fuse to use here. Also, would the mean I should keep or remove the fuse holder on the brown/blue -ve side wires?
Hi Ronnie ,
I used these type of fuse holders, they take standard size blade fuses so if you get caught out on the road a car spares shop will have them;

https://www.autosparks.co.uk/electrical-components/fuses-fuseboxes/blade-fuses-fuseboxes/30-amp-in-line-waterproof-fuseholder.html

In the below pic you can see how I set it up, Stuart gets the credit. One fused (15A) return from the positive battery terminal to a multi connector, this then collects the returns for the Tympanium reg/rectifier, the front of the bike, the back and the engine. I also fused the Tympanium so it has its own protection. I removed the original fuse from the negative terminal, you could leave it in but I didn’t see the benefit and it’s one more thing to go wrong.
DSCN2074.jpg
 

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Hi Ronnie ,
I used these type of fuse holders, they take standard size blade fuses so if you get caught out on the road a car spares shop will have them;

https://www.autosparks.co.uk/electrical-components/fuses-fuseboxes/blade-fuses-fuseboxes/30-amp-in-line-waterproof-fuseholder.html

In the below pic you can see how I set it up, Stuart gets the credit. One fused (15A) return from the positive battery terminal to a multi connector, this then collects the returns for the Tympanium reg/rectifier, the front of the bike, the back and the engine. I also fused the Tympanium so it has its own protection. I removed the original fuse from the negative terminal, you could leave it in but I didn’t see the benefit and it’s one more thing to go wrong.
View attachment 726453
Thanks very much @Rusty1! My Commando came with one of these type of fuseholders spliced into the battery wires as well. I'd assumed it was more of a safety measure to be able to pull the blade fuse out when parking it somewhere public so it wouldn't start up in a theft attempt.
 

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Hi Ronnie,

connections using the #34419 switch.
I've "EDIT-ed" my post #60 to add connection differences (and one similarity) between the connections for the #35710 and the #34419.

However, 'fraid you'll need some spade terminals and - ideally :whistle: - the different crimping tool for proper ones.

I've always used similar spade terminals (and insulators) to 'original Lucas', they're widely-available today including in the US certainly from British Wiring and are used on the better new harnesses for our old heaps, certainly including the one you bought from BW. (y) Otoh, one difficulty for an electrical newbie in the US is BW doesn't sell a crimping tool for 'em ... :rolleyes: I hope this is simply because they're available easily and cheaply from other sources and, when you e-mail BW for a recommendation, between him/them emailing back and you contacting the recommended vendor, you aren't delayed much more.

If using these good spade terminals is relatively easy for you:-

. Use these 1/4" male and female spades and corresponding "Covers" - on the face of it, terminals for 28-strand wire might look too big for the (mostly?) 14-strand wire in your bike's harness but, if you decide to use them, I'll detail the easy way of using them securely.

. If you follow this link and look at the lower image enlarged, you'll see the M-shaped cutouts necessary in one jaw of any crimping tool for these spade terminals.

end of a White/Brown wire with a female spade terminal
video you linked in your post #55, at 6:04
confirm [where] the other end of this reappears

only appears again at the ignition switch.
Risking labouring a point I posted earlier, the main difference between #35710 and #34419 is the latter needs two separate power supplies - to both its #3 and #7 terminals. Once you have male and female spade terminals, crimping tool and terminal "Covers", you have several options for adapting the existing harness to connect to the #34419 switch (in case using the #34419 switch is looking more daunting and expensive than you anticipated, be aware you need at least female spades, crimping tool and covers to connect a new #35710 switch):-

. Crimp two short wires into a male spade terminal, crimp a separate female spade to the other end of each wire, fit the male spade in the existing female on the end of the White/Brown wire out of the harness inside the headlamp shell, connect the female spades to #34419 #3 and #7 terminals.

. Connect the existing White/Brown wire female spade to either #34419 terminal #3 or #7, cut into the oil pressure warning lamp White wire, crimp a bullet terminal to each cut end, push them into a new 'double' snap connector, make up a new wire with a bullet on one end and female spade on the other, from the snap connector to whichever of the #34419 #3 and #7 terminals doesn't have the White/Brown wire.

. If you consider cutting into the oil pressure warning lamp White wire, don't use the White/Brown wire at all; having crimped bullets on the cut ends and used a 'double' snap connector, make up two new wires with a bullet on one end and female spade on the other, from the snap connector to both #34419 #3 and #7 terminals. In this case, I'd also disconnect the Brown/White from the ignition switch and tape up the terminals at both ends of that wire.

. Fwiw, if intending or allowing future fitment of a #35710, my first suggestion doesn't require any alteration to the standard harness; the extra Y-shaped piece would simply be removed. That said, either of the other two suggestions would only leave a 'single' snap connector in the oil pressure warning lamp White wire.

your post #36 to Ryan recommending adding a fuse to the +ve connecting red wire...
Would you recommend I do the same?
(y) Definitely. I hadn't repeated it up to now for you only because Plan A was to get everything connected and working as standard, then suggest modifications. :)

Personally not a fan of the waterproof blade fuse holders @Rusty1 Chris used; nothing wrong with 'em as fuse holders afaik, I just like the type that can be clipped together, to make neat blocks that can also include unconnected holders for spare fuses, so I don't lose 'em in pockets and similar. :rolleyes: Otoh, possibly more easily for you, the waterproof type are widely-available from multiple vendors including on US eBay.

post #57 from @TR7RVMan wherein he suggests that to continue using the dip switch I need installing of a diode in the high-beam circuit:
Would you recommend I do this too?
Mmmm ... what Don actually posted was:-
LED head light bulb is good. It will not do dip though. Defaults to high beam...
I'd probably leave it for now as you have some much else going on.
With all due respect to Don, these LED 'bulbs' are supposed to be a replacement for twin-filament incandescent bulbs, one filament being 'main' and the other 'dip'. So, if a specific LED replacement doesn't also do 'main' and 'dip', it's faulty.

The guy in GB who designs and commissions very-similar-looking LED says on his website (about half-way down the webpage, under "High Beam Light Fix Kit"):-
When you fit an LED headlamp bulb or bulbs you may [my stress] find that the high beam light comes on with dipped beam as well as high beam.
... and the headlamp then needs a diode.

Digressing slightly, I suspect CRDC has encountered the common 21st-century manufacturing problem - having designed and commissioned from GB, it's likely the manufacturing is actually in a Far Eastern country, several of which have a long history of 'making a few more' and then selling (aided and abetted by the likes of eBay) bypassing the original commissioner ... Short of flying to the manufacturer with a nail gun and nailing the boss's feet to the floor in front of his salesmen, not a lot to be done about this sharp practice?

Snag with it is, while CRDC likely has only a few bulbs that may require a "High Beam Light Fix Kit", users on the end of the supply chain direct from the Far Eastern manufacturer are more likely to get the shonky bulbs that didn't pass QC?

These are amongst the reasons I don't start down this path - the LED is an expensive sticking-plaster 'fix' over what was always simply a crap incandescent bulb and lens/reflector, then another sticking-plaster is needed for the fault in the first one ... :rolleyes: That said, I gained my experience on 7" headlamps and before LED; faced with a 5-3/4" headlamp like your bike's, I'd do my best not to use a LED headlamp bulb, but the experience I have could be a steep learning curve for a newbie.

Shorter answer: don't extrapolate Don's advice into not making the 'dip beam' connections. Once the bike's up and running with everything connected and tested, if you then find your headlamp bulb has the same problem as Don's, then see what solutions are possible?

Ronnie's
bike's new harness came from? So I'm not sure the wire sizes it has?

(y) Should have metric wire as afaict he/they buy both complete harnesses and components from Autosparks.

a new video link with the current state of the headlamp wiring in post #57 prior to pulling out the lighting and dip switch.
(y)

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Thank you @StuartMac and everyone else following along with help. Just another update below, but I will follow-up with a video a bit later when I regain my steam.

I went back through post #60 and #71. I believe I've done everything correct in accordance to your recommendations in using the #34419 light switch. Having done so, I reconnected the battery, toggled the ignition switch across each position and only the following occurred (I did not make any attempt to kick the bike over yet):

  • The red oil pressure warning light stays permanently lit, which I assume has to do with the fact that the white wire connected to the oil pressure bulb socket is connected at the other end to the ignition coil (-) terminal. Does this defeat the purpose of the oil pressure warning lamp if its always on via the ignition coil?
  • The brake light illuminates when the brake lever is applied.
  • The horn sounds when the horn switch at the handlebar is applied regardless of position or even if the key is not in the ignition switch.
No part of the headlight illuminates, including main beam, low beam, nor pilot light across any position in the ignition switch nor any position on the headlight switch.

No part of the green light 'main beam warning' lamp illuminates across any position in the ignition switch nor any position on the headlight switch.

I spent a few hours going back over all my connections, disconnecting and re-connecting to ensure all terminals were in holders all the way. Still the same results. I checked for continuity across the wires in the headlamp, and they all appear to be functioning.

This morning I decided to disconnect the headlamp and test it directly to the battery, connecting the +ve (green/grounded) wire from the main beam holder to +ve battery terminal (via an additional piece of scrap wire), and trying each of the black wires (main and low beam) individually attached to the -ve terminal. In all tests, the lamp illuminated successfully. I also observed a visible difference between high and low beam when each was individually illuminated.

I also tested the pilot light wires to the battery terminal, with the +ve (black/grounded) wire to +ve battery terminal, and the blue wire to -ve battery terminal. In the test, the pilot light successfully illuminated.

I'm at a bit of a loss. I can't understand what isn't correct.

Lastly, I went ahead and spliced in the fuses on the red +ve wire before the battery. I purchased the additional spades needed for the headlamp modifications from a British Only car repair shop near me who stocks directly from British Wiring (this is going to save me loads of time on delivery waits). I've also added in the red ground wire to the handlebar clamp bolt and at the other end, plugged it into the 8-way connector via a bullet terminal.
 

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. Not absolutely sure why the harness also has a Brown/Green wire end with a bullet terminal but without a connection; however, it might correspond to the the connection for the speedo. illumination bulb when the optional tacho. was fitted? Nevertheless, I advise changing the "single connector" (Video 5:58) to a double and connecting:-
Also, to this point, the mysterious brown/green wire with the bullet terminal in the headlamp shell I'd pointed out is actually green/red, leading to me realize it is the other of the two turn signal wires in the headlamp. Accordingly, I've put it in a single snap connector, not connecting to anything other side, as I did with the green/white.
 

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Third time's a charm as they say?! Well, not exactly in my case. Here is a video shot after going back through for a third time and re-checking all my connections with the advisements for the #34419 light switch. The first 3/4 of the video is just me re-verifying my connections. Rather than sit through me demonstrating what has already been advised, you can jump forward in the video at 6:42. To my very confused surprise, the headlamp illuminates after a few seconds, the green main beam indicator light then flickers off before I toggle the main light switch and then the dip switch at which point it turns off, then back on again for a bit, and then off again for good. It still hasn't come back on :confused:

Perhaps the bike just likes an audience? I attempted the ignition switch and light switch several times right before deciding to record and it never illuminated during those attempts either.

Any suggestions on what to check next?

Is there a specific continuity number on my multimeter I should be trying to verify across each set of wires, or is anything other than an OL (open line) considered working? My level of understanding continuity checking comes from short YouTube videos. :censored:

Could it be the two new fuses I added to each of the red wires in front of battery positive ring terminal? Both are 15A, but one is a micro-blade waterproof type and the other is a cartridge/glass fuse. The micro-blade holder has comparatively thicker wire.

Could it be a rectifier issue? If someone might be able to break down an "idiots guide" version of how to check it'd be beneficial for me to learn. I found a post in AccessNorton's board, but it didn't go into much detail on the process – I'm not quite understanding how to determine which diodes current goes which way, etc.

Could it be the grounding of the horn switch which @StuartMac has nudged me toward remedying via solder, to which I've thus far taken the easy route of just ground to the handlebar clamp bolt?

Thanks kindly!
 

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Hi Ronnie,

Is there a specific continuity number on my multimeter I should be trying to verify across each set of wires,
Continuity checking is basically one of two, depending what you want to discover:-

. Up to now, you've wanted to find out if a particular-coloured wire out of the new harness in the headlamp shell is the same or connected to the same-coloured wire out of the new harness in the under-seat area. For this, you should've used your meter's resistance/Ohms (could be just a horseshoe-shaped symbol) setting and put the end of each meter lead on a different end of the wire; the meter then uses its internal battery to make a circuit through the meter leads and the wire; if a circuit's made, the meter displays zero (= no resistance, although up to 0.5 Ohm on a digital meter is acceptable); if a circuit can't be made, the meter displays a high number, or some display the infinity symbol (looks like an "8" on its side). One thing to bear in mind when continuity-checking using no/resistance is the meter's internal battery must be good or it'll display weird results.

. Otoh, testing everything connected, you want to find out why the bike's battery isn't working a particular component, e.g. the headlamp. This time, you set the meter to a Volts scale; if the meter has more than one, because you're working with 12V electrics, pick the scale that max's just above 12V. Using Volts for continuity-checking, always connect the meter across the battery first, a fully-charged battery should cause the meter to display ~12.5V; even only 0.2V lower, it won't always power certain components ...

I went back through post #60 and #71. I believe I've done everything correct in accordance to your recommendations in using the #34419 light switch
reconnected the battery, toggled the ignition switch across each position
Firstly here, if you haven't done so already, for absolute clarity, I recommend you're certain of your bike's ignition switch 'All Off' key position. Reason is, when the switch on your bike was used originally '71/'72, on the T160 and '79-on twins, the 'All Off' key position was easy to see; however, because of the switch's position on your bike, the 'All Off' key position might not be so obvious and, for testing, you should be sure. If you haven't done so already, first turn the key fully-clockwise, then turn the key two clicks anti-clockwise; that's (should be) 'All Off'.

For further clarity, 'All Off' is not the key turned fully anti-clockwise.

The red oil pressure warning light stays permanently lit,
Could you clarify:-

. the OP lamp is "permanently lit" all the time the battery is connected;

. or only when the ignition key is in one of the two clockwise positions from 'All Off'?

If the latter:-

. When the ignition switch is turned to either of the clockwise positions from 'All Off', all White wires are energised. When the engine oil pressure is low (e.g. when it isn't running), the oil pressure switch on the engine is closed. If both switches are closed, the low oil pressure warning circuit is complete and the warning lamp is lit.

. The warning lamp usually extinguishes when you kick the engine over, because that (usually) generates enough pressure to open the engine switch, breaking the low pressure warning circuit. Certainly the lamp should extinguish when the engine starts. If it doesn't, risking stating the obvious, never run the engine with the lamp lit, always stop the engine first, then investigate why the lamp is staying lit.

The horn sounds when the horn switch at the handlebar is applied regardless of position or even if the key is not in the ignition switch.
Because one wire connected to the horn is Brown/Blue, that's unswitched power direct from battery -ve. The other - Brown/Black - wire is to the horn button on the handlebar. When you press the horn button, it connects to the handlebar and/or the Red wire I advised you to install; that Red wire (whether from the switch or a 'bar clamp bolt) completes the horn circuit back to battery +ve. (y) Aside, many modern vehicles allow the horn to be sounded even when the key is out of the ignition switch, imho a good emergency feature that Lucas shouldn't have changed '71-on. (n)

The brake light illuminates when the brake lever is applied.
The switch by the lever has one White wire and one Brown wire? If so, as above, when the ignition switch is turned to either of the clockwise positions from 'All Off', all White wires are energised; the switch Brown wire is connected to the brake filament in the rear bulb; the Red wire I advised you to connect to the rear lamp completes the brake lamp circuit back to battery +ve. (y)

Aside, before key-operated ignition switches on Britbikes, the rear brake switch was also supplied direct from battery -ve, allowing the brake light to be illuminated by pressing the lever even when the key was out of the ignition switch, also as on many modern vehicles. (y)

purchased the additional spades needed for the headlamp modifications from a British Only car repair shop near me who stocks directly from British Wiring
(y)

No part of the headlight illuminates, including main beam, low beam, nor pilot light across any position in the ignition switch nor any position on the headlight switch.
checked for continuity across the wires in the headlamp,
Here you should be checking continuity with your meter set to Volts:-

1. As advised above, first connect the meter across the battery, you should see ~12.5V.

2. Depending which of my suggestions in my post #71 you used to connect the harness to the #34419 switch #3 and #7 terminals:-

a. If the White wire, because the oil pressure warning lamp is illuminating, measure between the #34419 switch terminal(s) with (a) White wire (#3 and/or #7) and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1.

b. If the White/Brown wire, turn the ignition key fully-clockwise:-

i. measure between ignition switch terminal #3-White/Brown wire and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1;

ii. if you do, measure between the end of the White/Brown wire in the headlamp shell and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1;

iii. if you do, measure between #34419 terminal(s) #3 and/or #7 and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1.

3a. If you do, move the #34419 lever to the centre position and measure between terminal #4-Brown/Green wire and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1; is the tail-lamp illuminated?

b. If you do and it is, pull the pilot lamp out of the headlamp reflector, remove the pilot bulb and measure between the terminal in the bottom of the bulb-holder and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1.

4a. Move the #34419 lever to the 'All On' position and measure between terminal #8-Blue wire and battery +ve, you should see the same as you saw at 1.

b. If you do, measure between the terminals on the ends of the Blue/Red and Blue/White wires out of the handlebar horn/dipswitch; depending on the position of the dipswitch lever, either Blue/Red or Blue/White should have the meter showing the same as you saw at 1; if so, move the dipswitch lever to its other position and check the other of Blue/Red or Blue/White then has the meter showing the same as you saw at 1.

c. If it does, remove the headlamp bulb holder (ensure the LED bulb can't drop out accidentally), measure between each Black wire terminal and battery +ve; you should see the same as you saw at 1 when the dipswitch lever is set to energise either the connected Blue/Red or Blue/White wire.

At some point in the above test sequence, your meter likely won't display "the same as you saw at 1" but likely very low Volts; that'll be why components after that aren't working.

No part of the green light 'main beam warning' lamp illuminates across any position in the ignition switch nor any position on the headlight switch.
It won't 'til specifically there's power out of the dipswitch Blue/White wire - 4b above.

the two new fuses I added to each of the red wires in front of battery positive ring terminal? Both are 15A, but one is a micro-blade waterproof type and the other is a cartridge/glass fuse. The micro-blade holder has comparatively thicker wire.
Uh-uh, 'fraid you haven't followed what I wrote for Ryan in post #36:-

If the bike's harness has more than one Red wire attached to the battery ring terminal,
cut off the ring terminal, terminate each wire with an individual bullet terminal and push them into a snap connector
with a new 28-strand wire and blade fuse holder, the new wire becoming the only one connected to battery +ve
... i.e.:-

. each of the original harness Red wires should have just a bullet terminal on the end;

. all bullets should all be pushed into the same snap connector (one of the 8-ways you bought from British Wiring?);

. if your "micro-blade holder has comparatively thicker wire", hopefully the wire's 14AWG ("28-strand") not 16AWG, but just one blade-fuseholder should be connected between the snap connector and the battery +ve terminal;

... as you have it now, because all the Red wires are connected together, the two fuses are in parallel so capable of conducting at least 30A; in reality, 'blow' is normally twice 'continuous' so they could likely conduct 60A without blowing ... so regrettably as much protection as the proverbial chocolate fireguard ... :(

Also, it might be your terminology but the blade fuse type I recommend is shown here as "Standard" -



... as well as the height, note the terminals shapes and their positions compared to the plastic part; reason I recommend this particular fuse type is they're the most widely-available if/when you need spares, plus spares are less easy to lose than the smaller types.

Could it be a rectifier issue?
No. Rectifier is between alternator and battery, nothing to do with lighting.

added in the red ground wire to the handlebar clamp bolt and at the other end, plugged it into the 8-way connector via a bullet terminal.
Could it be the grounding of the horn switch
Uh-uh:-

. The standard Brown/Black wire and horn button 'ground' the horn; however, the button only 'grounds' to the handlebar; however, the horn circuit isn't complete 'til the electrons that left battery -ve for the horn through the Brown/Blue wire make it back to battery +ve through the Red wire.

. The original standard connections between handlebar and battery +ve Red wire were random bits of bike rubbing together, which was a triumph of hope over reality long-term (even short-term sometimes :eek:) ...

. By connecting a (Red) wire between a handlebar clamp bolt and the Red wires' snap connector in the headlamp shell, the number of "bits of bike rubbing together" are reduced to the horn button, switch body, switch mounting screws, handlebar, clamp and bolt 'til the electrons make it to a Red wire back to battery +ve. (y)

. Otoh, if - instead of the handlebar clamp bolt - that end of the (Red) wire can be soldered inside the switch body close to the horn button, the number of "random bits of bike rubbing together" are reduced to ... none. (y) (y)

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Hey @StuartMac,

Blown Fuses and Updating the Red Battery +ve Wires
I tested the voltage across my battery (connected, but not turned on) and observed 12.47V. Since you mentioned even only 0.2V less than 12.5V wont always power certain components, I decided to put the battery back on a charger to ensure it was at full, I then noticed the holder for the glass fuse I'd spliced into one of the two red wires to battery +ve had brown staining around it (bare in mind I installed it in new condition). Upon further inspection, it appeared melted/blown and the holder itself would not come apart with out prying (plastic melted). The contents of which, when opened, showed the spring burned and brittle and the glass fuse also stained brown. I then tested continuity on the ends of the blade fuse holder wires and saw it wasn't registering, so I pulled out the blade fuse from the holder, swapped in a new one and got continuity again. I discarded the blown fuses (which must've occurred during that video when the lights went out) and changed course to update the two red wires into a double connector to the fuse holder wires to battery +ve per your original suggestion (which I clearly misunderstood the first time). Oh, and can't recall if I said this but I'm using 15 amp "mini" fuses.

Tail Light Red Wire Added On
Having been putting off the red wire addition to the tail light, I decided to pursue that before reconnecting the battery. I grounded it to one of the bolts on bulb housing. The process of threading it along the inside rear fender and through the rubber grommet opening near the battery, with the other two brown wires, was easier than I suspected.

Broken Spade On Terminal #6
I reconnected the battery, continuity across the battery and battery wires checked out. I began going through continuity across all the wires again and everything was showing correct. I was about to move onto the voltage checking when sadly, while taking off the female spade connected to the Brown/Green wire at terminal #6, the male spade broke off. :( I then took the Brown/Green wire and pressed it onto the available terminal #4.

726759


Hello Voltage
With the battery charged up, I was getting a 12.57 reading, so I reconnected it. I turned the ignition switch fully clockwise, flipped the light switch from Off to Pilot to Main Beam (far left, middle, far right). Some success! The pilot illuminated and stays lit across both the middle and far right position. I'm assuming the main beam isn't turning on due to the broken spade and lack of Brown/Green wires (now connected to terminal #4) connected to said spade at lighting switch position #6? I experimented with swapping the positions on the light switch, but never was able to get the main beam to illuminate. However, when I then swapped the main beam black wire (connected into a double connector with the Blue/White wire from the dip switch and the Blue/White wire connecting to the Main Beam Warning lamp) with the pilot beam Solid Blue wire (in the double connector that has Brown/Green wire going to [for now] terminal #4 [which also has the other Brown/Green from the harness wire crimped together in a female spade] and the Brown/Green wire going to the speedo), it illuminated the main beam but no longer the pilot light.

Here is a run down of the Lighting Switch positions and what they're connected to on lighting switch #34419B at present.

Light Switch Terminal #1: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #2: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #3: White/Brown wire (which is crimped together at its other end to another other brown wire at terminal #7 with a male spade terminal, which then connects via female spade terminal to the White/Brown wire coming from the main harness to ignition switch terminal #3)
Light Switch Terminal #4: (Currently due to #6 being broke) two Brown/Green Wires together, one goes to main harness [and out to brake light filament] the other goes into a double snap connector which is shared one side with the Brown/Green wire from the speedo and the Solid Blue pilot beam wire going into the bulb contact.
Light Switch Terminal #5: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #6: Empty (Currently empty because broken, but should be the two Brown/Green Wires togehter)
Light Switch Terminal #7: White/Brown wire (which is crimped together at its other end to another other brown wire at terminal #3 with a male spade terminal, which then connects via female spade terminal to the White/Brown wire coming from the main harness to ignition switch terminal #3)
Light Switch Terminal #8: Solid Blue wire connecting at its other end to a single snap connector which is attached to the Solid Blue wire coming from the dip switch.

Other connections in headlamp: (just to confirm)
Red wire from harness (connects to battery +ve at the other end) goes into 8-snap connector along with the Red ground wire connected to the handlebar clamp, Black ground wire from the pilot lamp (soldered to bulb housing at other end), Red ground wire connected at the other end to the main beam warning lamp housing, and the Green ground wire connected at the other end to the main beam bulb housing via solder.

Blue/White wire from dip switch connects in a double snap connector to the Blue/White main beam warning lamp wire with a bulb contact, and the Black main beam wire (closest to pilot lamp).

Blue/Red wire from dip switch connects to a single snap connector, which connects on the other side to the Black low beam wire (furthest from pilot lamp).

Brown/Black wire from dip switch connects to a single snap connector, which connects on the other side to the Brown/Black wire from the main harness (which connects to the horn at the other end).

Solid Blue wire from dip switch as mentioned above, connects to a single snap connector and on the other side connects to a Solid Blue wire that connects to Light Switch Terminal #8.

Turn Signal wires are still blanked off on both ends with single snap connectors.
Red/Green wire connects directly the oil pressure switch and oil pressure warning lamp.
White wire connects directly the ignition coil -ve terminal and the oil pressure warning lamp.

New Switch? Or can it be repaired?
This leaves me with the dilemma of ordering a new switch or ordering the screws that are absent from the #31276 switch I do have. I am of the feeling that I should stay the course with the #34419B switch, as I've already gone through and added the female spades and other connections per that route. If you feel it'd be wiser to go back to the #31276 switch and hunting down corresponding screws, I'll pursue that path but haven't found any source for the screws reference number in the part book. It just shows the whole unit as one part number. Lastly, is it possible to repair/replace this spade?

Method for White/Brown Wire
. Crimp two short wires into a male spade terminal, crimp a separate female spade to the other end of each wire, fit the male spade in the existing female on the end of the White/Brown wire out of the harness inside the headlamp shell, connect the female spades to #34419 #3 and #7 terminals.
Just confirming I've opted for the route above.


Ignition Switch Order
Firstly here, if you haven't done so already, for absolute clarity, I recommend you're certain of your bike's ignition switch 'All Off' key position. Reason is, when the switch on your bike was used originally '71/'72, on the T160 and '79-on twins, the 'All Off' key position was easy to see; however, because of the switch's position on your bike, the 'All Off' key position might not be so obvious and, for testing, you should be sure. If you haven't done so already, first turn the key fully-clockwise, then turn the key two clicks anti-clockwise; that's (should be) 'All Off'.

For further clarity, 'All Off' is not the key turned fully anti-clockwise.
Keeping in mind this is occurring with my Brown/Green wires attached a light switch terminal #4 instead of #6 (due to break), my Oil Pressure Warning Light only illuminates at the full clockwise AND full counter clockwise positions. It does not illuminate in the All Off position, nor 1 click clockwise from All Off.

My pilot lamp illuminates with the light switch toggle in either the middle or left position (right is all off) when the ignition switch is at 1 clicks clockwise from All Off AND 2 clicks clockwise from All Off. Also, with the ignition switch in either of these positions, with the pilot lamp illuminated, when I flip the dip switch I see a very small spark of light momentarily flash from the main beam.

Ignition Switch Positions
Just to triple confirm, my ignition switch wires are in the following positions:
Terminal #1: 2 Brown/Blue Wires
Terminal #2: 1 White/Brown Wire
Terminal #3: 2 White Wires
Terminal #4: Empty (Blanked off with female spade terminal in spade terminal cover)


Phew! That took nearly longer to type up and document than anything else :)
 

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Hi Ronnie,

tested the voltage across my battery (connected, but not turned on) and observed 12.47V. Since you mentioned even only 0.2V less than 12.5V wont always power certain components,
Bear in mind meters aren't always accurate. Strictly-speaking, the chemicals in each fully-charged lead-acid-type battery cell have a potential difference of 2.1 Volts. A '12V' battery is six cells in series so the actual fully-charged Voltage is 12.6V. A good meter will show this but cheaper meters aren't always so accurate and that can confuse; that's the reason I put a "~" (= "approximately") in front of the "12.5V". :)

If your meter reads 12.6V fully-charged, half-discharged is actually 12.3V.

holder for the glass fuse I'd spliced into one of the two red wires to battery +ve had brown staining around it (bare in mind I installed it in new condition). Upon further inspection, it appeared melted/blown and the holder itself would not come apart with out prying (plastic melted). The contents of which, when opened, showed the spring burned and brittle and the glass fuse also stained brown. I then tested continuity on the ends of the blade fuse holder wires and saw it wasn't registering, so I pulled out the blade fuse from the holder, swapped in a new one and got continuity again.
Hmmm ... something to keep an eye on - a fuse shouldn't develop enough heat to melt the fuse-holder plastic but not blow ... :(

Just as a matter of interest, when you installed the cylindrical fuse holder, was it assembled with wires in the terminals, or did you have to solder the terminals to the wire ends? Then was one of the wires through the spring - so only the fuse was between the two wires' terminals - or was the fuse and the spring between the wires' terminals?

using 15 amp "mini" fuses.
(y)

Ignition Switch Positions
Terminal #2: 1 White/Brown Wire
Terminal #3: 2 White Wires
These two are the wrong way 'round - plain White should be on #2, White/Brown on #3. Then one click clockwise from 'All Off' energises just the White wires, second click clockwise keeps White wires energised while also energising White/Brown to the Lighting switch.

Oil Pressure Warning Light only illuminates at the full clockwise AND full counter clockwise positions. It does not illuminate in the All Off position, nor 1 click clockwise from All Off
pilot lamp illuminates
when the ignition switch is at 1 clicks clockwise from All Off AND 2 clicks clockwise from All Off
... because of the above - full clockwise and full counter clockwise connect terminal #1 (Brown/Blue from battery -ve) to terminal #3, plus terminal #2 in the full clockwise but not the full counter clockwise positions.

When you swap the wires on terminals #2 and #3, the oil pressure warning lamp and pilot lamp will illuminate correctly. (y)

Ignition Switch Positions
Terminal #4: Empty (Blanked off with female spade terminal in spade terminal cover)
(y)

Broken Spade On Terminal #6
took the Brown/Green wire and pressed it onto the available terminal #4.
😩 My bad, it should've been on terminal #4 all along - #3-to-#4 are connected when the switch lever's moved to the middle position, and those two terminals remain connected when the switch lever's moved to 'All On', which should also connect #7 to #8.

Light Switch Terminal #1: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #2: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #3: White/Brown wire (which is crimped together at its other end to another other brown wire at terminal #7 with a male spade terminal, which then connects via female spade terminal to the White/Brown wire coming from the main harness to ignition switch terminal #3)
Light Switch Terminal #4: two Brown/Green Wires together, one goes to main harness [and out to brake light filament] the other goes into a double snap connector which is shared one side with the Brown/Green wire from the speedo and the Solid Blue pilot beam wire going into the bulb contact.
(y)

Light Switch Terminal #5: Empty
Light Switch Terminal #6: Empty
(y)

Light Switch Terminal #7: White/Brown wire (which is crimped together at its other end to another other brown wire at terminal #3 with a male spade terminal, which then connects via female spade terminal to the White/Brown wire coming from the main harness to ignition switch terminal #3)
Light Switch Terminal #8: Solid Blue wire connecting at its other end to a single snap connector which is attached to the Solid Blue wire coming from the dip switch.
(y)

Hello Voltage
turned the ignition switch fully clockwise,
... which connected Brown/Blue from battery -ve to both the plain White wires and the White/Brown wire ...

flipped the light switch from Off to Pilot to Main Beam (far left, middle, far right).
The pilot illuminated and stays lit across both the middle and far right position.
Now it's on the correct Lighting switch terminal #4, that's (y) No worries about #34419 terminal #6, it isn't needed. (y)

flipped the light switch from Off to Pilot to Main Beam (far left, middle, far right).
with the pilot lamp illuminated, when I flip the dip switch I see a very small spark of light momentarily flash from the main beam.
To be clear:-

. "Main Beam" is only one of two in the headlamp;

. "light switch ... far right" is the only lever position that connects #34419 terminal #7 to terminal #8;

. #8 has the plain Blue wire to the handlebar dipswitch;

. it's the dipswitch that determines whether headlamp "main beam" or "low beam" is energised;

. whichever of "main beam" or "low beam" in the headlamp gives the "flash" is determined by the handlebar dipswitch position.

Nevertheless, as you've previously tested both headlamp "beams" by other connections and the pilot lamp switched through #34419 terminals #3 and #4 is working normally, at worst the headlamp problem can only lie between the White/Brown wire's #34419 terminal #7 connection and the dipswitch Blue/White and Blue/Red connections to the headlamp bulb-holder's Black wires:-

Once you've corrected the other problems, if the 'no headlamp' problem remains, as in my previous post, set your meter to Volts, first connect it just across the battery and note the meter reading then:-

. Turn the ignition key fully-clockwise then connect the meter between Lighting switch terminal #7 and battery +ve; do you see the same meter reading continuously (no "flash")?

. If you see the same meter reading continuously, move the #34419 lever to the 'All On' ("far right"?) position and measure between terminal #8-Blue wire and battery +ve; do you see the same meter reading continuously (no "flash")?

. If you do, measure between the terminals on the ends of the Blue/Red and Blue/White wires out of the handlebar horn/dipswitch; depending on the position of the dipswitch lever, either Blue/Red or Blue/White should have the meter showing the same meter reading continuously; if so, move the dipswitch lever to its other position and check the other of Blue/Red or Blue/White then has the meter showing the same meter reading continuously.

Broken Spade On Terminal #6
New Switch? Or can it be repaired?

This leaves me with the dilemma of ordering a new switch or ordering the screws that are absent from the #31276
As the broken terminal #6 on your #34419 isn't of any consequence, the only reason to replace the switch at present is if it has a fault between terminals #7 and #8 that prevents it powering the headlamp.

If you do have/want to replace your #34419, I advise against trying to reuse the #31276 - it can only be an on/off switch for one component, it was just for the headlamp in '71/'72.

Otoh, the linked switch from Steadfast would be ideal. But not because they've listed it as a replacement for a #34419, that's someone talking from a normally-concealed orifice ... #31788 actually functions the same as the #35710 originally listed for your bike. (y)

With a correct Lighting switch fitted, if the ignition switch ever develops a fault you don't want to fix, you have the options of replacing with either the same or the correct 2-position switch.

Other connections in headlamp: (just to confirm)
Red wire from harness
Blue/White wire from dip switch
Blue/Red wire from dip switch
Brown/Black wire from dip switch
Solid Blue wire from dip switch

Tail Light Red Wire Added
Method for White/Brown Wire

White wire connects directly the ignition coil -ve terminal and the oil pressure warning lamp.
Red/Green wire connects directly the oil pressure switch and oil pressure warning lamp.
Turn Signal wires are still blanked off on both ends with single snap connectors.
(y)

Hth.

Regards,
 
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