Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums banner
  • Hey everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of this month's Bike of the Month Challenge!

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
83 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all.

Been thinking about the solution to my speedo today.

For those who don't know I have fitted a complete 1050 speed trip front end onto a 2006 Daytona frame.



Which leaves me without a speedo drive from the front wheel as per the Daytona. Now the 2006 'tona has an electronic speedo so the "drive" from the front wheel is just an electric pick up. The connection looks to be exactly the same at the speedo connection on the 1050 motor I also have. . I checked out that pick up point which is from the gearbox.

The plate that is mounted into on the 1050 motor is there on the 955 motor. The pick-up sensor sits just above a gear. presumably just inboard of the gearbox sprocket.

Now my GSXR had a very similar set-up, except its pick-up was from the sprocket, which is obviously affected by the gearing being used. Triumph have avoided that by taking the pick-up from within the gearbox.

So If I were to drill the hole in the same location on the 955 motor as on the 1050 motor, would the pickup err pickup?

What do ya think?

so - been digging a bit more. There are lots of digital pickup units out there on t'internet, so I'm pretty confident that somethng can be made to work if the 1050 sender unit wouldn't. - still not convined it wont, and that would be the perfect solution, If it works its a brilliant fix, but taking the leap of drilling a hole in the crankcase is a big step, without concrete proof that it will.

http://www.bykebitz.co.uk/acatalog/Acumen_Instrumentation.html list a electronic pickup unit foe the accumen digi display...

SPEEDO CABLE UPGRADE KIT FOR DG8
The DG8 is designed for bikes with digital speedometers but purchasing this Speedo Cable Upgrade Kit will provide the output you need even when your bike is fitted with a cable speedometer. Simple to fit, comes with instructions and fittings.
Price: £39.13 Including VAT at 15%

and some interesting reading on
http://www.magsensors.com/geartooth.html

this is on a buell, but the idea is the same.
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/47623/335298.html?1202407572

or

http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=produ.....prod/prd246.htm

So I gues the nxt question is what type of sensor is fitted to the 1050 speed triple engine.

If its the same as the Inductive speed sensor

in the site above. then it will do the job.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
139 Posts
So you have an 06 daytona motor and harness and a 1050 front end? (just being sure I understand).

No chance of any 955i wheel fitting? You can replace a mechanical speed sensor from an early S3 (98-01 at least) with an electric speed sensor from the right years of sprint.

What is the width between the forks?

What is your axle bolt size?

Was there much fab work to mount the front end? Your frame is 02-04?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
83 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Yes the 06 daytona front wheel does fit in the speed triple forks -. I had it in place until I got the SP3 wheel, which now matches the SP3 rear :)

The speed sensor for the daytona is electric. It is just driven from the front wheel, which the speed trip wheel obviously doesn't have the facility for.

loom is for a 06 Daytona and the clocks are 06 Daytona. The 1050 sensor connection for the speedo is exactly the same as the Daytona connection. Its just the sensor location that is different.


Frame is 06 Daytona. Speed trip front end went straight in with no modification.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
139 Posts
Could the 1050 wheel be machined? If you put Duc wheels on I understand that is what some folks have done.

Cool news about the 1050 front end just fitting. I was think about this same thing the other day. Seems ALOT more straight forward compared to GSXR.

I don't know enough about how the speedo works much more use than that :)

Good luck!
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
...
Cool news about the 1050 front end just fitting. I was think about this same thing the other day. Seems ALOT more straight forward compared to GSXR. ...
Maybe but .....

http://www.triumphrat.net/speed-triple-forum/103001-how-do-you-feel-about-your-05-forks.html

(no disrespect intended trackdayrider)

For the speedo drive:

I am pretty confident just about any Hall Effect type sensor and magnets could be utilized

See my solution on my Mrs SV650 with GSXR front clip - http://forum.svrider.com/showthread.php?t=86338

The std SV650 axle/wheel driven speedo sender is actually very similar to the Triumph front wheel unit.
You would actually need less magnets I believe - either one or two I think. Very simple to adjust for actual speed as it will be an even multiple.
Start with 2 - if 2x the speed is displayed, remove one - if 1/2, add two more.

Now you could also hook this up on the final output drive, just like the GSXR - you would drill & tap the end of the output shaft and install the sender flag; then mount the sensor on the sprocket cover.
The big disadvantage is you would need to add a speedo healer to the tune of $100 or so in order to calibrate it, as the ratio would be quite different from stock front wheel sender
(you will also have this issue with the Triumph 1050 sender, even if it could be mounted on the case)

The front wheel solution per the SV mod is simple and low cost!

(p.s.note the update later in the thread where I replaced the magnets with nice rare-earth items - if you have space for the GSXR sender without having to grind on it for physical location reasons, I'm again pretty confident those high field magnets will trigger the sender from a further spacing)
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
Here's a Ducati speedo sender - you may also be able to use one of these




Suzuki one should be more readily available and certainly more cost effective!
Actually any model GSXR, Hayabusa, TLS, TLR, SV1K all use exact same sensor



There are a ton of these available on EBay UK for less than 20 pounds


Since you already have a GSXR here's a simple test for you at no money outlay:
Simply take your GSXR sensor off your other bike and rig up the sender to the Triumph speedo connector:
Turn on the ignition, then take a magnet and just move it back & forth rapidly ~ 5mm or so from the edge if the sensor (remember it is edge triggered! not face) and see if you get an indication on the gauge.
If you do, then you can proceed to get another one off EBay and rig up the mechanical fitment similar to what I did and mount your magnets on the brake rotor.

I'll get the electrical connections for you in a moment!

...............GSXR sender .........Daytona Harness

Power .... Black/Red ............. Black/Yellow
Ground.... Black/White ......... Black
Signal ..... Black ................... White/Blue
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
trackdayrider - Since I had all the bits at my disposal I thought I'd check this out further for you - it's actually been on my agenda to validate this for some time anyway.

I actually have an old GSXR harness which not only donated the plug that fit the GSXR sender, but also conveniently gave up another which fit the Daytona harness speedo input!
So I made a simple extender cable with each of those connectors on either end.

Then I took the speedo sender off my TL and plugged it in the extender, then the extender into the Daytona harness.
Turned on the ignition, and per the previously suggested test, just took a magnet and oscillated it back & forth across the sensor face.

Bingo! Good reading on the speedo commensurate with the rate at which I was moving the magnet.

So this validates that the process works!
The last remaining piece is how many magnets to use to trigger the source but that is simple.
My money is on either one or two. :p

This is the GSXR/TL/Hayabusa sensor:



This is the sender mounted on a simple bracket on my SV - the bracket is mounted to the fender stanchions with modified (very short) screws so that they dont interfere with the actual fender mount screws on the outside of same stanchions:





Magnets mounted on the rotor are the triggers. They just need to be positioned on a radius that sweeps past the sensor location.

.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Electronic Speedo for 2000 955i with '06 1050 front end?

This is the sender mounted on a simple bracket on my SV - the bracket is mounted to the fender stanchions with modified (very short) screws so that they dont interfere with the actual fender mount screws on the outside of same stanchions.

Magnets mounted on the rotor are the triggers. They just need to be positioned on a radius that sweeps past the sensor location.

DEcosse -
really need your insight and brainpower here as I have swapped the front end of my 2000 Daytona for the forks/wheel of a 2006 Speed Triple 1050...the problem is, the Daytona is a completely 'mechanical' speedo setup and the speedo drive cannot be made to fit the Speed Trip front wheel (at least not that I can see b/c of spacing issues.

Sooooo, I had wanted to do the 'electronic' speedo conversion as you mentioned above using a GSXR sender but since my speedo and ECU are not capable of reading the 'electronic' signal, can you give me a recommendation? Is there any way to rig up a stand-alone electric speedo (hopefully using a digital Sprint speedo as the actual clock.

Is there any way to make this work without a late-model 'digital speedo' ECU? Thanks in advance for noodling this with me :)
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
Try a Sprint ST speedo - that is an electronic speedo with analog style display - you should be able to hook that up to the alternative GSXR sender mod mentioned.
The Sprint speedo is not quite a direct fit in the OEM tri-cluster but should be not too dificult to retro - similar envelope, same diameter round instrument

Note that I have not tested this but believe it will work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Thanks DEcosse - I actually just bought the GSXR sender off of Ebay and found a Sprint electronic speedo there as well that I'll buy today.

Just wanted to be sure that I didn't require any 'interpolation' of the signal from the late-model ECU...better put, wanted to make sure that I could 'plug n play' using just the sender and the speedo unit...we'll soon see :)

Once I hook it up, I'll report back. Probably be a week or two depending on shipping time. Thanks again!
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
Just to be sure - I meant the ST speedo, yes? Not the integrated unit from the Sprint RS (which I know there are a couple on EBay right now)

The ECM does indeed buffer the signal, however there is a 1:1 ratio between the input & output.
The early aforementioned Sprint RS actually feeds the speed signal directly into the instrument and I am reasonably confident that most speedo's will have their own input buffer.

This is the Sprint speedo I was talking about:



I see I already gave you this information - http://www.triumphrat.net/speed-tri...50-wheel-on-early-model-spacer-questions.html :confused:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
83 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
...swapped the front end of my 2000 Daytona for the forks/wheel of a 2006 Speed Triple 1050...the problem is, the Daytona is a completely 'mechanical' speedo setup and the speedo drive cannot be made to fit the Speed Trip front wheel (at least not that I can see b/c of spacing issues.

Sooooo, I had wanted to do the 'electronic' speedo conversion as you mentioned above using a GSXR sender but since my speedo and ECU are not capable of reading the 'electronic' signal, can you give me a recommendation? Is there any way to rig up a stand-alone electric speedo (hopefully using a digital Sprint speedo as the actual clock.

Is there any way to make this work without a late-model 'digital speedo' ECU? Thanks in advance for noodling this with me :)

I fitted a 1050 wheel into my 2006 Daytona.
I used a 1050 speedo sensor (from the gearbox) which pluged straight into the 955 wiring loom with no modification.
Then mounted the sensor as per DEcosse's mod with 4 earth magnets in the brake disc mounts

dead easy and works a treat
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
363 Posts
DeCosse is correct on the use of the Sprint speedo in the S3 gauge housing. However, the Sprint speedo is shallower than the S3 which means you need to be creative with the mounting of the gauge in the cluster - extend the studs, or in my case, I used a screw with a small length of nylon tube similar to this:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/314HvzJ2EQL._AA280_.jpg
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
22,109 Posts
Broken link Lugan - I tried to find it to fix it but couldn't make it work

Meanwhile here is link to your own excellent project for Fixed_Ops to see the end result
(the cluster doesn't look that different other than colour of the gauge - that's great - still looks OEM)

http://www.triumphrat.net/sprint-forum/95190-st-fighter-or-universal-british-motorcycle.html



Keep it simple in your case Fixed_Ops - just replace the speedo gauge. Will keep the wiring changes minimal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
DEcosse - you are correct in that I'm getting the Sprint ST electronic speedo gauge (analog, not digital RS style).

As for the mounting/spacing of the magnets, can anyone give me a picture and/or measurements on the spacing and number of magnets that I need on the rotor? Thanks in advance, again! :)
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top