Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums banner

1 - 20 of 84 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi all,



It's been a couple of months since i've had the TEC cam places in my Street Scrambler after I saw the convincing video of TEC that claimed the top-end RPM to become usable while the lower-end RPM would stay in tact.

After trying many things I have to say that i'm disappointed in the results. The image below shows the comparison of a stock bike with mine (TEC cam, V&H full exhaust, K&N filter, snorkel removed, booster plug). After there "upgrades" it went from 81NM at 2900 rpm to 75NM (5 less) at 4200 rpm and 65/70 at 2900 rpm. HP has increased, but only with around 4HP, while there's 15 HP being claimed when you only swap the cam. The only part that is true to the claims is the torque being available until 7000 rpm, but I've trading in a lot for that gain.

People are talking about off-road tunes, but after a lot of research I found out that this tune is no longer available for Street Scramblers since medio 2017 and I haven't found any dealer to help me out and get it on my bike some other way (even the dutch importer wouldn't).

This situation got me stuck between the dealer claiming that everything went right while installing and TEC claiming that it might be the exhaust or bad cam timing. But I can't see how that's possible with this cam and using the right tools.

My last resort is the Power Commander, but i'm getting quite sceptical with this. Is this really going to give me my low-end torque back and bridge the min 10HP gap? Especially the low-end torque is the thing I'm missing the most on the bike.

What would your next step be? I just want the bike to perform as claimed on the videos.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,453 Posts
Never believe everything that is claimed, just throwing in a hot cam and claiming to get another 15 hp is a big claim, there is more to that than just throwing in a bigger cam, some cams work better mid range and the hotter ones work best at top of the range but for hot cams to really work other work needs to be done, there is head work that is needed, tunes for the new cam, the exhaust system, air flow etc etc, just throwing in cam and expect it to perform might work but at what cost losing torque down the lower RPMs.

Ashley
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
714 Posts
I tend to think the dealer screwed up the timing. The cam chain can ‘bunch’ or ‘kink’ unless pressure is kept on it to keep it taut. Took me three attempts to get it spot on. Very happy with the results of my cam, no loss of low down or midrange and it keeps pulling where the stock cam fell off a cliff.

It’s not a big job to re-check the timing and I would certainly do that before getting into the potential nightmare of a power commander.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
I tend to think the dealer screwed up the timing. The cam chain can ‘bunch’ or ‘kink’ unless pressure is kept on it to keep it taut. Took me three attempts to get it spot on. Very happy with the results of my cam, no loss of low down or midrange and it keeps pulling where the stock cam fell off a cliff.



It’s not a big job to re-check the timing and I would certainly do that before getting into the potential nightmare of a power commander.
Did you use a timing tool from Triumph to keep the cam in place? I'm not having the right tools so I might have to go and ask the dealer to open it up again. Hopefully not at too much costs.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
714 Posts
Did you use a timing tool from Triumph to keep the cam in place? I'm not having the right tools so I might have to go and ask the dealer to open it up again. Hopefully not at too much costs.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
No, just a flat piece of aluminium is fine. It’s only to locate the cam not lock it. Once I had established the correct timing I took the cam out again and torqued up the sprocket bolts with the cam held in a vice, before re-fitting and double checking. You have to remove the chain tensioner to allow sufficient slack in the chain to remove the original cam and with the morse type chain the slack (front) run can bunch up. This makes you think you have the timing right when you actually don’t.

My bike has a Meercat X pipe with standard silencers, standard air filter (but without snorkel) and no booster plug or other device. It’s running the latest tune (available from any dealer). Your bike has had so many changes the problem could be them all failing to work together.

You don’t need any special tools to check the valve timing, just a couple of Allen keys and normal spanners (wrenches). If the timing is right I would try putting the rest of it back to standard, starting with the booster plug which ‘fools’ the ECU into thinking the engine needs extra fuel. Horrible things.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Ive watched TEC videos and read a lot of reviews of their various products (cams, shocks, fork kits, etc.) Have to say I'm not very impressed with their reputation and really question their claims.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
714 Posts
Ive watched TEC videos and read a lot of reviews of their various products (cams, shocks, fork kits, etc.) Have to say I'm not very impressed with their reputation and really question their claims.
Fine. Your prerogative. I, personally, am delighted with the performance boost their cam has given my 900. Absolutely delighted. It’s gone from a machine I was looking forward to selling to one I want to keep.

With regard to the original poster, I wonder if the dealer re-set the valve clearances properly? All 8 of mine were tight (mind you, 6 were tight before I started - I don’t have a lot of faith in Triumph’s assembly workers anymore). If the valves are tight it’s never going to perform properly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
137 Posts
I tend to think the dealer screwed up the timing. The cam chain can ‘bunch’ or ‘kink’ unless pressure is kept on it to keep it taut. Took me three attempts to get it spot on. Very happy with the results of my cam, no loss of low down or midrange and it keeps pulling where the stock cam fell off a cliff.



It’s not a big job to re-check the timing and I would certainly do that before getting into the potential nightmare of a power commander.
Totally agree. It's easy to mess up with the adjustable cam sprockets. One reason to do the job yourself is your not against a ticking cost job. My ST is great with the cam I accept I've never placed it on a Dyno but it sits at 90mph all day with grunt still on the throttle. It's gets a thrashing every day in and out of London then 15 miles along the M4 and seems like stock but as others have mentioned the power doesn't drop of suddenly but just flattens out. I have noticed it's getting better as the mother losses up.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
137 Posts
Also. What's this booster plug supposed to do . I've never fitted one or touched the ECU and all seems fine. Im told the ECU self maps and adjusts if your trying to fool it with interference devices maybe it's constantly trying to adjust the interference out. Others who know more about fuel injection please answer

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
337 Posts
Also. What's this booster plug supposed to do . I've never fitted one or touched the ECU and all seems fine. Im told the ECU self maps and adjusts if your trying to fool it with interference devices maybe it's constantly trying to adjust the interference out. Others who know more about fuel injection please answer
The booster plug simply tells the ECU that the incoming air is colder than it actually is, so the ECU compensates by injecting more fuel to make the mixture richer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Totally agree. It's easy to mess up with the adjustable cam sprockets. One reason to do the job yourself is your not against a ticking cost job. My ST is great with the cam I accept I've never placed it on a Dyno but it sits at 90mph all day with grunt still on the throttle. It's gets a thrashing every day in and out of London then 15 miles along the M4 and seems like stock but as others have mentioned the power doesn't drop of suddenly but just flattens out. I have noticed it's getting better as the mother losses up.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
Thanks for your feedback. I'm going back to my dealer after my holiday and ask them to open het up again and check the timing and valve clearance. Keep you posted.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
186 Posts
Thanks for your feedback. I'm going back to my dealer after my holiday and ask them to open het up again and check the timing and valve clearance. Keep you posted.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
Good, your experience with the cam is out of sync with the others of us who have installed one. I am sure you will get a resolution and end up happy.. I hope you do as you deserve it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
100 Posts
Hi all,



It's been a couple of months since i've had the TEC cam places in my Street Scrambler after I saw the convincing video of TEC that claimed the top-end RPM to become usable while the lower-end RPM would stay in tact.

After trying many things I have to say that i'm disappointed in the results. The image below shows the comparison of a stock bike with mine (TEC cam, V&H full exhaust, K&N filter, snorkel removed, booster plug). After there "upgrades" it went from 81NM at 2900 rpm to 75NM (5 less) at 4200 rpm and 65/70 at 2900 rpm. HP has increased, but only with around 4HP, while there's 15 HP being claimed when you only swap the cam. The only part that is true to the claims is the torque being available until 7000 rpm, but I've trading in a lot for that gain.

People are talking about off-road tunes, but after a lot of research I found out that this tune is no longer available for Street Scramblers since medio 2017 and I haven't found any dealer to help me out and get it on my bike some other way (even the dutch importer wouldn't).

This situation got me stuck between the dealer claiming that everything went right while installing and TEC claiming that it might be the exhaust or bad cam timing. But I can't see how that's possible with this cam and using the right tools.

My last resort is the Power Commander, but i'm getting quite sceptical with this. Is this really going to give me my low-end torque back and bridge the min 10HP gap? Especially the low-end torque is the thing I'm missing the most on the bike.

What would your next step be? I just want the bike to perform as claimed on the videos.
It has been my experience that many Dyno's give different results so when TEC did their test it might have been on a more generous Dyno in perfect weather conditions etc, than yours, also I don't know anything about the V & H exhaust on a scrambler or if the Cat is removed but on theirs I bet it is which would probably pad their numbers, also the booster plug won't add any power it just smooths out the throttle response, and it wouldn't surprise me that they had access to a different tune that probably isn't available anymore.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
It has been my experience that many Dyno's give different results so when TEC did their test it might have been on a more generous Dyno in perfect weather conditions etc, than yours, also I don't know anything about the V & H exhaust on a scrambler or if the Cat is removed but on theirs I bet it is which would probably pad their numbers, also the booster plug won't add any power it just smooths out the throttle response, and it wouldn't surprise me that they had access to a different tune that probably isn't available anymore.
You're right about the off road tune. George had it on his bike. But is that going to make a 15NM @ 2900rpm and 10 HP @ 6500 rpm difference?

The chart in my first post has a comparison between stock and mine just like George has on his video.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
186 Posts
You're right about the off road tune. George had it on his bike. But is that going to make a 15NM @ 2900rpm and 10 HP @ 6500 rpm difference?

The chart in my first post has a comparison between stock and mine just like George has on his video.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
Seriously I did the Tech conversion and it was awesome on my old Street twin (900) just like yours.. are the V&H pipes the decat pipes?? because i have no experience of them.. i used a Tech xpipe and my old bike responded well. Reckon its likely valve timing on yours bike.. or your bikes not a decat. Plus yank ur snorkel as well
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
137 Posts
Btw does anyone know if the latest high output ST tune can be uploaded to the early low output model and if anyone has done it and seen a difference. Also has anyone got the triumph part numbers for the can between the old and new model to see if it's changed. If it has it might be a fit into the old model instead of a Tec cam. We need a friendly dealer to have a mess around with an old bike and new parts

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Seriously I did the Tech conversion and it was awesome on my old Street twin (900) just like yours.. are the V&H pipes the decat pipes?? because i have no experience of them.. i used a Tech xpipe and my old bike responded well. Reckon its likely valve timing on yours bike.. or your bikes not a decat. Plus yank ur snorkel as well
V&H decat pipes and K&N airfilter. My visit tonthe dealer will clear up a few thing hopefully.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Fine. Your prerogative. I, personally, am delighted with the performance boost their cam has given my 900. Absolutely delighted. It’s gone from a machine I was looking forward to selling to one I want to keep.



With regard to the original poster, I wonder if the dealer re-set the valve clearances properly? All 8 of mine were tight (mind you, 6 were tight before I started - I don’t have a lot of faith in Triumph’s assembly workers anymore). If the valves are tight it’s never going to perform properly.
Is it possible to reset valve clearances without removing the alternator cap?

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CLT-L29 met Tapatalk
 
1 - 20 of 84 Posts
Top