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Discussion Starter #1
Good Morning Everyone,
So, I have asked a few questions concerning the wiring on my 1962 Bonnie and I figure maybe I should at least let you guys see what I started with and where she is as of today. As I am sure most of you know, 1962 was the last year for the pre-unit bikes and the last of the Duplex frames. Makes this a nice bike to restore but also a little on the harder side compared to my 1968 Bonnie and 1967 Daytona. But eventually I will get her done. I have done all the work myself except for the paint. So here is an as purchased picture followed by a where she is today. The pipes and header nuts that are on her now, are just for breaking her in when I get her started. After I have her tuned up and running well, I will install the new and correct exhaust to keep the headers from bluing right away.

Thanks, Rob
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Discussion Starter #4
Making a little more progress with the 62 Bonnie. Started wiring the bike which is proving to be more challenging than it should be. I also installed the new Amal monobloc carbs. If I can get the wiring figured out the rest of the bike will be done fairly quickly.

Rob
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Discussion Starter #5
Made a little more progress yesterday on the 1962 Bonnie. Got the rear fender mounted up (for the 2nd time), due to having to have it repainted again because of garage damage. OOPS! Also mounted up the tail light assembly.

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Discussion Starter #6
I also managed to get a little more wiring done. Installed the light switch under the seat.

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Discussion Starter #7
If anyone has any experience wiring one of these bikes, I would appreciate talking to you.

Thanks,
Rob
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I posted about this new Lucas wiring harness in another post earlier. This is how it came and I can not find anyone selling a better more complete wiring harness. However, those wires are now connected to the light switch under the seat. What I would really like to see is a picture under the seat to see how the wires are routed, and inside the headlight bucket. As I stated previously, this bike was mostly in boxes and not disassembled by myself, so I don't know how the bike came apart to be able to put it back together the same way. In addition, most of this bike was not original and cobbled together over the years very badly.

In addition to the pictures, I don't quite understand how to wire the taillight and rear brake light switch together and into the main harness. Some help there would be appreciated. Also, inside the headlamp bucket, is there supposed to be some place to connect all the grounds, or were they just all connected together and then connected to ground somewhere else. All of the schematics show a plug to quickly disconnect the headlight, but I can't find a wiring harness like that either so there is no quick disconnect plug on my bike.

Thanks for the help,
Rob

P.S. The wiring is about all i have left to get the bike started and then finish assembly.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Also, a pic of how the wires come down to the stator and mag would be helpful. I am trying to put this bike back to as original as I can. Lastly (for now), my mag has what looks like a place to stick a hose of some kind. What is that for?
 

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All the grounds in the headlight shell go to 1 or 2 4-way female junctions (flat, double-wide metal loops with rubber cover). If one of them won't do, you simply make a short red wire jumper to a second one.

main harness looks like it's basically in position, just drop the alternator leads (green/white & green/yellow or white/green) down the rear vertical frame tube (w/ cable ties to hold it in place). The mag should have a single white ground wire.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks for your help. Follow up question: Once the grounds are all tied together in the headlight shell, where do they then get connected to ground? Somewhere in the headlight shell?

My wiring harness and the wiring diagram I have do not have a white wire going to the brake light switch, but I think I can figure it out.

Also, what about the connection on the mag that looks like it is supposed to have a hose connected to it? I have the white wire for the cutout switch connected to the mag, but it has a nipple where a hose could connect to it.

Lastly, where can I get the mag cutout switch to mount on the handlebars? I cannot seem to find that anywhere.

Thanks again,
Rob
 

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Hi Rob,

trying to put this bike back to as original as I can.
would really like to see is a picture
inside the headlight bucket
to see how the wires are routed,
Ball up all the wires hanging out of the headlamp shell, push the ball into the headlamp shell, ram it in tight with the headlamp and leave any problems for the dealer to sort out ...

Oh ... hang on ... there aren't any Triumph dealers who know how to fix wiring installed as Meriden seems to have mostly done ... you mean you want your bike's electrics to be reliable? :LOL:

Joking apart, I appreciate you want an original-looking bike but are you really going to show off the inside of the headlamp shell? Even if your answer is, "Many times", there a few tricks that'll give reliable and neat-looking electrics:-

. Risking stating the obvious, the headlamp fits in the middle of the shell and the reflector fills most of it ...

. So wires between stuff at the top of the shell (Ammeter, switches, speedo.) and the wiring entrance/exit hole at the bottom/towards the rear of the shell need to be long enough to be routed around the sides of the shell without any strain.

. A wire that only routes through the entrance/exit hole just to connect to another wire also routed through the entrance/exit hole, ideally, the connection should be arranged to lie flat in the bottom of the shell.

. Don't trust the off-the-shelf lengths of wires between the headlamp itself and the rest of the harness; do at least some rough measurements to see how far back in the shell the bulb plug ends up when the headlamp's in the shell and, when you hold the plug in at least roughly the same position, that the wires between it and the rest of the harness aren't scrunching up your other neatly-arranged wiring ... amhikt. :rolleyes:

. I try to arrange the length of the wires between the headlamp and the rest of the harness to be just the right length so, when the headlamp's out of the shell, the lens'll rest on the fender (on a cloth on a painted fender), the wiring isn't strained (y) but also the wires aren't so long the headlamp can slip off the fender, swing and bang against something. (n)

. If I have to cut a wire that appears to be too long, I cut off only half the length it looks like should be cut off - easier to cut off a bit more or use the extra length than replace an entire wire that it turns out I've cut too short ... again, amhikt.

. If the wire I'm thinking of shortening is a long one, I make a small loop before cutting off the aforementioned "half". Once the bike's been used for a bit, forks turned, etc., surprising how many of those loops have disappeared ... and again ... :)

would really like to see is a picture under the seat to see how the wires are routed,
Absent one, ime route as far from the oil tank as possible, if only to stop condensing oil vapour contaminating the wiring.

wire the taillight and rear brake light switch together and into the main harness.

white wire sending power to the brake light switch which sends power to the brake light thru a brown wire.
red to ground.
My wiring harness and the wiring diagram I have do not have a white wire going to the brake light switch,
Correct, Paul is thinking of '66-on Triumphs, with original 12V electrics and coil ignition.

The only White wires on your bike are between the mag. and cut-out button and between cut-out button and some sort of 'ground'(?).

Your bike's rear brake light switch is supplied unswitched power - Brown/Blue wire - directly from battery -ve.

"red to ground" was originally only about mid-'71-on. Nevertheless, ime it's a damn' good idea to have the brake light illuminating reliably - a Red wire beside the Brown and Brown/Green wires all the way from the lamp (the bulb-holder itself?) to the two existing Red wires bolted to the rectifier, so eventually to battery +ve.

Wires routing - if possible, I'd try to route the wires from the rear lamp entrance/exit up to and then under the horizontal 'bar' to the fender, with just a short visible loop from the front of the 'bar' between the fender and the frame tube to join the main harness under the seat?

inside the headlamp bucket, is there supposed to be some place to connect all the grounds, or were they just all connected together and then connected to ground somewhere else.
Once the grounds are all tied together in the headlight shell, where do they then get connected to ground? Somewhere in the headlight shell?
Uh-uh, the Red wires are the primary return to battery +ve, the harness should have a Red wire from the Red wires in the headlamp bucket to battery +ve. If the harness doesn't have such a Red wire, I strongly advise adding one. Also connect Red wires from electrical components elsewhere on the bike to this Red wire.

The cycle and engine parts will be connected to the Red wires' network either because the network has one or more Red wires with ring terminals that are supposed to connect to components' mountings to frame or engine, or there's a Red wire spade connection to something like the rectifier's mounting stud. However, it's unwise to rely on the random bits of bike between such connections for electrical continuity, instead of a Red wire between them.

While we're on the subject, if the harness doesn't already have a fuse/holder in the one-and-only wire to be attached to battery +ve, I strongly advise adding one.

All the grounds in the headlight shell go to 1 or 2 4-way female junctions (flat, double-wide metal loops with rubber cover). If one of them won't do, you simply make a short red wire jumper to a second one.
British Wiring calls these "female junctions" Double Snap Connector Sleeves (common connection for four wires); BW also sells similar common connections for six wires and for eight wires.

All of the schematics show a plug to quickly disconnect the headlight, but I can't find a wiring harness like that either so there is no quick disconnect plug on my bike.
Prolly just as well; aiui, they were randomly "quickly disconnect" ... say, as you headed for a random bend with a random precipice beside it ...

a pic of how the wires come down to the stator
would be helpful.

alternator leads (green/white & green/yellow or white/green) down the rear vertical frame tube
trying to put this bike back to as original as I can.
I'm not sure the "GREEN/WHITE" (insulation mainly Green with White tracer) alternator-to-rectfier and rectifier-to-lighting-switch wires shown in the Triumph workshop manual wiring diagram wasn't a Meriden Misprint - contemporary Lucas wiring diagrams show them as the better-known White/Green (insulation mainly White with Green tracer). However, even if it was Green/White and not a misprint, please confirm you aren't trying to use a near-60-year-old alternator, you have got a newer one, with one wire White/Green (or all Yellow wires)?

If so, what DC are you going for, 6V or 12V?

And you're using a proper late-20th-century (sic) combined regulator/rectifier, not the failure-prone Stone Age AC 'regulating' wiring shown in the diagram between alternator, rectifier and lighting switch?

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Thanx for the correction/clarifications, Stuart. Yes, my brain works mainly in "unit" mode...

Lucas headlight shells (and most replacements) have a ground connection female clip inside, at the bottom, that a red male bullet should plug into.

No matter what color the two wires are from the alternator stator, as long as two input wires from the rectifier connect to them. The other two wires from the rectifier should be Brown/Blue and Red that go to the battery.

(feel free to correct the above, but it should be close)
 

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Also, I believe a certain range of Lucas alternators may have had THREE wires, of which the user could connect any two TOGETHER to one of the rectifier wires, then the other one to the remaining wire.

They are NOT "3-phase" just because they have three wires!
 

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Hi Paul,

Lucas headlight shells (and most replacements) have a ground connection female clip inside, at the bottom, that a red male bullet should plug into.
Amplification.

Even assuming the clip's present, how good a "ground" it makes depends on the age of the shell, because where the clip is rivetted is also where any water that manages to get inside the shell collects and rusts the shell. ? E.g. the clip was present in my first T160's headlamp shell, Lucas assumed a Red wire connected to it would make a good 'ground' for the front turn signals screwed into the shell; after a few years of water collecting and rusting the shell under the clip ... :oops:

If all the lamps (headlamp, pilot lamp, speedo. lamp) on Rob's bike have Red 'ground' wires, connecting them to that headlamp shell clip - if necessary through "female junctions"/snap connectors - shouldn't cause a 'ground' problem because the harness should have a Red wire from the rectifier also connected to that clip. If there's then a Red wire connection from the rectifier to battery +ve, Rob's bike's harness essentially has a 'ground wires network' that doesn't require connection to sundry bits of metal to work.

Otoh, if Rob's bike's headlamp shell doesn't have the clip, but all the lamps have Red wires, simply connecting the harness Red wire from the rectifier to the other Red wires in the headlamp shell in a snap connector, and a Red wire connection from rectifier to battery +ve, will work exactly the same.

Otoh2, any lamp that doesn't have a Red wire must 'ground' through contact with the headlamp shell, it then relies on a good, clean connection between shell and clip (and attached Red wires) for its electrical return to battery +ve. As I say, if the connection between shell and clip isn't clean or doesn't always remain so, Rob's bike will experience lighting 'grounding' issues at some time. It's exactly why I constantly disparage 'ground' through random bits of bike, and advise 'ground' through insulated wires and connections.

alternator leads (green/white & green/yellow or white/green)
No matter what color the two wires are from the alternator stator, as long as two input wires from the rectifier connect to them. The other two wires from the rectifier should be Brown/Blue and Red that go to the battery.
I believe a certain range of Lucas alternators may have had THREE wires, of which the user could connect any two TOGETHER to one of the rectifier wires, then the other one to the remaining wire.
This is confused.

A stator Green/Yellow wire would only be definitely connected to a rectifier AC terminal/wire if the stator has only two wires. In this case, the other wire (connected to the other rectifier AC terminal/wire) is White/Green. Original 2-wire stators are RM21/22/23 and '69-on.

If Rob's bike does have a 2-wire stator, it isn't original and - more importantly - he cannot connect the harness to the alternator, rectifier and lighting switch as shown in the pre-unit workshop manual wiring diagram for "LATER T110, TR6 AND T120".

I'm not aware of any original pre-'69 and pre-RM21/22/23 Lucas stators that weren't 3-wire (single-phase). Specifically so they could be connected to rectifier (ignition) and lighting switches as shown in all 6V DC wiring diagrams (including the pre-unit workshop manual wiring diagram for "LATER T110, TR6 AND T120").

These connections were specifically to 'regulate' the alternator output before Zener diodes.

The Green/Black wire is connected to one end of one pair of stator coils, the Green/Yellow wire is connected to one end of the other two pairs. White/Green (or Green/White) is common to the other ends of all three pairs.

Then connecting specifically the Green/Yellow and White/Green (or Green/White) wires to different Lighting Switch contacts used the Lighting Switch to divert the power generated by the two pairs of stator 'lighting coils' as required depending whether lights were 'off' or 'on'.

I believe a certain range of Lucas alternators may have had THREE wires, of which the user could connect any two TOGETHER to one of the rectifier wires, then the other one to the remaining wire.
No.

Because of the 3-wire stator connections I've described above, if two stator wires are joined together on one rectifier AC terminal/wire, they can only be the Green/Black and Green/Yellow; White/Green (or Green/White) must always be connected to a rectifier AC terminal/wire on its own.

Also if these connections are made, wires directly between stator or rectifier AC connections and the lighting switch (and the ignition switch on 6V DC coil ignition bikes) must be disconnected and some other regulation must be connected. Originally, this was done from '66 on Triumphs (from '65 on some BSA's) and a Zener diode connected across the battery was for regulation.

I'm hoping Rob will clarify exactly what his bike does have and what he'd like electrically.

Hth.

Regards,
 

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Discussion Starter #18
My bike does have three wires coming from the alternator in the colors that Stuart mentions. My bike also only has a rectifier, there is no Zener diode like on my 1968 Bonnie. But according to the wiring diagram, there is only a rectifier. As for the headlight grounding, my brand new trim ring does have a connection point but it is not a great ground. After taking some ohm readings, I think I am going to ground all the ground in the headlight to the headlight bolt. That measures a perfect short all the way back to where the rectifier is mounted. So it looks like I have will have a ground connection in the headlight shell, with a red wire that is in the harness that goes back to where the rectifier is mounted. That red wire will be bolted to the frame where the rectifier mounts. That red wire seems to also be connected to the red wire that attaches to the Battery positive side. So, unless some one says differently, I believe I am set there. Now I just have to work out how the brake light, and brake light switch get wired up and how to wire up the magneto cut out switch. Can I wire the cut out switch to the same ground in the headlight bucket?

Thanks,
Rob
 

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I know I have come late to this discussion and I may have missed a reference to British Wiring. They may have some things you may need and they are located in Pennsylvania. Here's a link
1960's
 
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