Loose handlebar controls - Triumph Forum: Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums
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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-21-2019, 11:22 PM Thread Starter
Minitwins
Main Motorcycle: 1971 T100R
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Loose handlebar controls

Looking for suggestions for workarounds to get handlebar controls on tight. These are slipping badly on a new handlebar thought the cases are locked as tight as possible, I'm guessing shims, but what do folks recommend? These controls were tight before I took them off for cleaning and soldering bad connections - maybe the PO had glued them?

This is a 71 T100R I finally got around to redoing after having garaged it 5 years after I bought it. Just finishing the rewiring and am about to replace control cables and carbs. Should know soon if this even runs. I'll be back with more questions I'm sure - thanks for this forum and the great people and resources here.
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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-21-2019, 11:59 PM
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Roll some black tape around the bars under the switches a few times.
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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 12:39 AM Thread Starter
Minitwins
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Originally Posted by triumpt120rv View Post
Roll some black tape around the bars under the switches a few times.
Won't that turn to goo over time in the heat and start slipping? I was thinking a sheet of thin rubber, or the 'good for anything' beer can shim.
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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 03:08 AM
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Are you trying to fit 7/8” switches to a 22 mm bar?

Consider rubbing the flat faces of the clamps down a bit on abrasive paper on a flat plate
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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 04:21 AM
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Hi,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tritn Thrashr View Post
Are you trying to fit 7/8Ē switches to a 22 mm bar?
Consider rubbing the flat faces of the clamps down a bit on abrasive paper on a flat plate
If the bike has 22 mm. OD handlebars, I'd sooner consider using a spares supplier that doesn't supply shonky pattern crap ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by eisenmen View Post
Just finishing the rewiring
'Fraid the Red wires attached to the oil tank:-

Loose handlebar controls-img_3391.jpg

... are about as much use as a chocolate spoon - the oil tank and battery carrier are rubber-mounted ...

Those Red wires should be attached to the engine (to provide an electrical return path to battery +ve from the points if you're using 'em and the oil pressure switch, and HT between the plugs and coils). There should be two studs that pass through the inlet rocker-box and cylinder head into the block, the head steadies attach between the top parts of these and the rear vertical bracket under the main frame top tube, the Red wires' ring terminal should be on one of those studs. An educated guess says you'll have to cut off the pictured ring terminal and fit a 3/8" ID one, because the shonky pattern harness maker cared so much they fitted the wrong ring terminal ...

Loose handlebar controls-img_3393.jpg

Interesting ... "Main Motorcycle" beside your posts show "1971 T100R" but that picture appears to show a pre-'71 Ammeter in the headlamp shell ...?

Hth.

Regards,

Stuart
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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 10:21 AM
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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 12:09 PM Thread Starter
Minitwins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StuartMac View Post
Hi,


If the bike has 22 mm. OD handlebars, I'd sooner consider using a spares supplier that doesn't supply shonky pattern crap ...


'Fraid the Red wires attached to the oil tank:-



... are about as much use as a chocolate spoon - the oil tank and battery carrier are rubber-mounted ...

Those Red wires should be attached to the engine (to provide an electrical return path to battery +ve from the points if you're using 'em and the oil pressure switch, and HT between the plugs and coils). There should be two studs that pass through the inlet rocker-box and cylinder head into the block, the head steadies attach between the top parts of these and the rear vertical bracket under the main frame top tube, the Red wires' ring terminal should be on one of those studs. An educated guess says you'll have to cut off the pictured ring terminal and fit a 3/8" ID one, because the shonky pattern harness maker cared so much they fitted the wrong ring terminal ...



Interesting ... "Main Motorcycle" beside your posts show "1971 T100R" but that picture appears to show a pre-'71 Ammeter in the headlamp shell ...?

Hth.

Regards,
Good catch on the ground points, will adjust. That battery box connection is attached to the frame ear so it does ground OK. There's also another ground for the engine in the harness at the engine mounts you mentioned. I've been following how the PO had it set up - probably not a good idea I guess. This harness has 4 other ground points and continuity checks out across the frame (so far). I have no idea what brand harness this is, there was no packaging - but I'm impressed with the quality and cable fit so far. But I'll take your advice.

On the headlight shell - yes the PO picked up a different one for some reason, I also have his original which has no ammeter and three warning lights but it was a little banged up. The PO had sourced a boatload of new and old parts and I'm working with what he accumulated.

If I decide to connect the Ammeter - do I need to run leads directly from the battery for the most accurate reading? This harness had no connections for an ammeter of course.

Many thanks!

Last edited by eisenmen; 07-22-2019 at 12:55 PM.
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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 04:25 PM
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I would cut a strip of rubber from an old inner tube (or buy a bicycle one new if you have to?)
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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-22-2019, 05:52 PM
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Hi,

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Originally Posted by eisenmen View Post
harness has 4 other ground points and continuity checks out across the frame
Uh-uh ... 'fraid that's a classic newbie mistake; the later the Britbike, the fewer of any of the cycle parts are "ground" ... the Red wires poking out of the harness are (should be) connected together and to battery +ve - they are the primary "ground", between a given Red wire terminal on an electrical component and battery +ve is the continuity you should be checking.

If the harness was for a '71 Triumph, the rear lamp might not have a Red wire (Lucas appears to have added it part-way through '71) and the turn signals won't but essentially they're the only components that didn't have either a discrete Red wire connection or one attached to their mounting (and they can be added easily).

So, if the engine has another Red wire connection from the harness, the one in your picture (attached to an oil tank mounting) was intended to attach to an electrical component's mounting - if it reaches, to the bracket where you've attached the turn signals relay? That bracket was originally where the rectifier mounted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eisenmen View Post
If I decide to connect the Ammeter - do I need to run leads directly from the battery for the most accurate reading?
It's quite a lot of wiring pain to connect an Ammeter to '71-on wiring, for not a lot of gain ...

For an Ammeter to work, the current must pass through it; standard Britbike Ammeters have a scale with a central zero and are connected between battery -ve, the original rectifier and the 'consumers' - ignition coils, bulbs, etc. via the ignition switch. In theory:-

. when the Ammeter needle's between zero and "-", the rider can see the 'consumers' are drawing from the battery;

. as engine and alternator rotor rpm increase, more is supplied by the alternator to the consumers, less is drawn from the battery so the Ammeter needle indicates closer and closer to zero;

. at a high-enough engine/alternator rpm, the alternator supplies all the 'consumers' in use and starts to charge the battery, then the Ammeter needle moves to between zero and "+" ...

However, in practice, the standard Ammeters were/are always small, low-quality and affected by vibration on a twin; apart from when the engine isn't running, at best, an owner gains experience of roughly where the Ammeter needle waggles with given consumers in use (essentially lights on or off) and makes an educated guess as to whether the battery's being charged, or not ...

When Ammeters were fitted to most bikes:-

. the Brown/Blue wire essentially went just from battery -ve to one Ammeter terminal;

. the other Ammeter terminal, original rectifier and Zener diode were connected by Brown/White wires to one ignition switch terminal; if you've replaced rectifier and Zener with a combined regulator/rectifier, its DC -ve wire is connected to Ammeter and ignition switch in place of the rectifier connection ...

... see what I mean about "quite a lot of wiring pain ... for not a lot of gain"?

Some will advise fitting a Voltmeter in place of the Ammeter - its wiring connections are just two wires, one to each battery terminal; 2" and 50 mm. OD Voltmeters can be had relatively-easily; even digital to avoid "waggly needle", albeit you need one with emi protection or the HT sends it doolally ... Ime and mho, the modern colour-changing/flashing LED do a better job of charging failure warning while costing less and taking up less space ...

Hth.

Regards,

Stuart
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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 07-23-2019, 12:26 AM
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well you could use shim brass or an aluminium beer can shim, but honestly get proper some 7/8" bars. Using rubber or tape etc won't solve the issue, esp. when you start pulling on the clutch lever.

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