Suddenly Dead T100 Electrical - Page 2 - Triumph Forum: Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums
Air Cooled Twins Talk Discussion of Hinckley Triumph Twin related matters and topics.

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 12:06 PM
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Also check your ground connection on the underside of the bike.

Marty
2005 Bonneville Blue 790cc, AI removed, Staintunes RC, no snorkel, inlet enlarged, 118/40/NBZT needles/1 shim/3 turns, Ikon 7610s, Ricor Intiminators, Barnett green clutch springs, Michelin Pilot Activs, D9 gauge panel, tachometer.
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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-24-2018, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by ericgraig View Post
I have no power whatsoever to my 2013 T100. Bike started fine. Three blocks from home I stopped at a light. Bike stalled or something. Went to restart, got all the indicators but the engine wouldn't turn over. Tried again, and again got all the indicator lights but the bike wouldn't still start. Tried a third time and no indicators or electrics or anything. Got the bike home still didn't start. Checked the fuses in the right hand side compartment and all appear to be OK. Battery charge was verified, the bike has enough juice.

Any ideas before I bring the bike into the dealer? Is there anything that should be obvious that I haven't tried? I don't have an indoor place to work on bike so I'm somewhat limited in what I can do.

She's just plain dead.
If you have your ignition switch on a relocation bracket I would tell you to check that out first, the brackets force you to mount the switch upside down and that lets in water and that plus spark erosion corrodes the contacts away.

However, going on what you are saying I think it more likely that you have internal breakages in the wiring harness. Post 2011 models with the electronic speedo are famous for this. There are about 5 crimp joints inside the harness, right at the point where it passes the steering head. Movement of the steering causes them to break. There are many threads on here where this has happened.

Its a big job for you, considering that you have nowhere to work on the bike. Perhaps someone you know would let you use their garage for a few days. Either way, if I am right, the only thing that you can do is open up the wiring harness and redo or solder the joints up. If the bike is still under any warranty the dealer would fit a new complete wiring harness but this still has a chance of happening all over again.

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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 12:35 PM Thread Starter
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More strange stuff. The engine dis NOT crank with the Microstart. I decided to remove the wires for the Microstart and all the accessory wires hooked up to the battery thinking maybe one of them was interfering with the bike. Turned the key and powered the bike on and this time the idiot lights came on but still not cranking. Tried it again and.. it started! Before anyone says that the MicroStart cable was causing the problem, I reinstalled it on another bike and it worked fine.

I like the clean the battery terminals theory but it raises another question. Trying to connect anything other than just the main battery cables to the battery is a huge pain. The battery bolts they supply are just not long enough for more than MAYBE one accessory. The bolt just doesn't reach the nut. You can get it on with lots of cursing a shimming but there has to be a better solution. I've found it hard to find a bolt with the same threads as the nut in just the right length needed for the accessories I have (heated grips, the MicroStart cable and a cable for my heated jacket). Why don't battery suppliers provide several bolts? Is there some sort of terminal block you can buy that makes this easier. It's bad on the Triumph but much worse on my FJR where access to the battery is really bad.

Finally, I was wondering whether its a bad practice to start the bike up before the idiot lights have gone through their full cycle. I'm an impatient New Yorker. Could this have caused the problem?

And yes, you can't go anywhere on this bike without the Allen key required to remove the seat.The extender bolts are useless. If you tighten them by hand they either fall off while you're riding or they get stolen. Both have happened to me.
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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by ericgraig View Post
More strange stuff. The engine dis NOT crank with the Microstart. I decided to remove the wires for the Microstart and all the accessory wires hooked up to the battery thinking maybe one of them was interfering with the bike. Turned the key and powered the bike on and this time the idiot lights came on but still not cranking. Tried it again and.. it started! Before anyone says that the MicroStart cable was causing the problem, I reinstalled it on another bike and it worked fine.
I still feel that you have dodgy crimp joints inside the harness. You will have to see how it goes now that the bike runs but I get the feeling that the problem will be back at some point. I hope that I'm wrong, by the way, because its one heck of a job to open the harness and repair the joints. The intermittent nature - now it works, now it doesn't - points toward the crimp joint problem.

Quote:
I like the clean the battery terminals theory but it raises another question. Trying to connect anything other than just the main battery cables to the battery is a huge pain. The battery bolts they supply are just not long enough for more than MAYBE one accessory.
That's because, strictly speaking, you are not meant to hang all your accessories directly off the battery. A proper installation should have ONLY the thick battery cables plus the charging wire bolted to the battery.

Quote:
The bolt just doesn't reach the nut. You can get it on with lots of cursing a shimming but there has to be a better solution. I've found it hard to find a bolt with the same threads as the nut in just the right length needed for the accessories I have
I can't see a problem.

The thread is the extremely popular M6x1, and anyone who is doing as you are attempting would just get a brass M6 bolt, slightly longer than needed and cut it down to length with a junior hacksaw. You may not even need to do that, since the bolt lengths go up in increments of 5mm. I think the standard bolts are 15mm long so you could use a 20mm. It doesn't need to be so exact since there is a few mm to spare under the nut when the bolt is tightened.

Quote:
Is there some sort of terminal block you can buy that makes this easier. It's bad on the Triumph but much worse on my FJR where access to the battery is really bad.
Yes there is - its called an auxiliary fuse box. You can get them from 2 fuses to 12 fuses. They have a single wire running to the battery positive terminal and some types are fitted with LEDs on the fuses which will light up when the fuse has blown. These save you from having all those individual inline fuses hanging off the battery.

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Quote:
Finally, I was wondering whether its a bad practice to start the bike up before the idiot lights have gone through their full cycle. I'm an impatient New Yorker. Could this have caused the problem?
I doubt it. You should wait, but if you start the bike early the cycle will be completed anyway. You may be an impatient New Yorker but you can't rush the ECU. Until that is ready you have no start button.

Quote:
And yes, you can't go anywhere on this bike without the Allen key required to remove the seat.The extender bolts are useless. If you tighten them by hand they either fall off while you're riding or they get stolen. Both have happened to me.
There are other options. A quick release seat catch is available in either pull-cable or key lock version. No more bolts. Search the forum for 'quick release seat latch' or send a PM to @steventhechef .

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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericgraig View Post
I have no power whatsoever to my 2013 T100. Bike started fine. Three blocks from home I stopped at a light. Bike stalled or something. Went to restart, got all the indicators but the engine wouldn't turn over. Tried again, and again got all the indicator lights but the bike wouldn't still start. Tried a third time and no indicators or electrics or anything. Got the bike home still didn't start. Checked the fuses in the right hand side compartment and all appear to be OK. Battery charge was verified, the bike has enough juice.

Any ideas before I bring the bike into the dealer? Is there anything that should be obvious that I haven't tried? I don't have an indoor place to work on bike so I'm somewhat limited in what I can do.

She's just plain dead.

Thanks.

Eric
I'd ****ing kill myself before i brought my bike to a dealership for that. A test meter and sound logic are your friends.
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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 08:44 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks, this is enormously helpful and enormously depressing. Living in NYC, I don't have any friends with garages. I can't believe that after only 16K miles these connections wold go bad. Makes one wonder if this is bike that's worth owning. At least not with an accessory garage in which to do repairs. I've been in the headlight and seen the mess of wires that live back there. I have to imagine that getting access to connectors you mention requires taking lots of stuff off the bike just to get at them. Not a job for me to do.
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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 01:38 PM
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Your battery is five years old. It's done, or almost done in the best of circumstances. Replace it and let us know what happens.

Marty
2005 Bonneville Blue 790cc, AI removed, Staintunes RC, no snorkel, inlet enlarged, 118/40/NBZT needles/1 shim/3 turns, Ikon 7610s, Ricor Intiminators, Barnett green clutch springs, Michelin Pilot Activs, D9 gauge panel, tachometer.

Last edited by Baltobonneville; 02-26-2018 at 01:40 PM.
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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 02:40 PM Thread Starter
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Not the battery. The bike wasn't starting even if it was jumped.
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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericgraig View Post
I have to imagine that getting access to connectors you mention requires taking lots of stuff off the bike just to get at them. Not a job for me to do.
Just the gas tank needs to be removed. The 5 crappy splices are inside the wiring loom that runs from the headlight to the main loom just under the left side of the tank:



Detail of one of them in all its glory after the blue insulating tape is unwrapped:

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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-27-2018, 08:40 AM Thread Starter
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You're motivating me to find an indoor place to work. Again, this is very much appreciated. Right now the bike is being ridden on trips where I can afford to breakdown. I think I may tuck into to when I have offspring home from college to give me a hand. Electrical engineering students ought to be able to do something other than solve math problems. Maybe I'll even tackle the overdue 12K service!

BTW, stupid question... one would need to remove the bad length of wire and add some new wire, right? There won't be enough slack to just pull a bit of wire from the bundle?

Last edited by ericgraig; 02-27-2018 at 08:43 AM.
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