Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums banner

T100 vs T120 - decisions, decisions

67K views 51 replies 33 participants last post by  nferr 
#1 ·
T100's are out for the US now, and I'm in a pickle. Identically accessorized, the price difference between a T100 and a T120 is 'only' (of course that's a relative term, but bear with me) a difference of $1,085. Now I really don't know which way I should jump- $1K more isn't that much in the larger scheme of things for a much more powerful bike.

Or do I say 'damn the torpedoes' and stick to my original scheme of getting a '16 air-cooled T100 for a lot less than either of the water-cooled models?

Thank goodness I've only got a few months to stew over this burning question :D (Finances will be bike-ready in the late winter/early spring!)

Advice, suggestions, and dire warnings are all accepted graciously !
 
#2 ·
If the price diff over there is only around a grand, I'd go with the T120. However, check the included specs first. The T120 has dual discs, center stand, heated grips, six speed, cruise option and the bigger donk. If the T100 has all this with the smaller motor, it would be worth considering as well. The ST 900 motor is a gem, but has to run a bit harder with the five speed box on the freeway at elevated speeds.. The ST is a great town / day ride bike
 
#3 ·
Ride a demonstrator with each engine spec. You will soon know whether the 900 is enough for you. The way power is delivered is the most important thing with these engines and, taking account of the weight differences which tend to level out the performance difference to some extent, its a matter of personal preference.
 
#4 ·
I have an air cooled T100 and the water cooled T120. While I've never ridden a STwin, I would seriously consider an "older" T100 (new or used) - just given the price difference of those two I don't think the new waters are worth what could be double the price of a good used T100. Having said that, I think the new T120 is heads and shoulders better than the air cooled T100. Good luck with this decision over the coming months, it is a nice "problem" to have.
 
#5 ·
I also have one of each - a '12 Base Bonneville and a '16 T120. The new bike is heavier and a bit sluggish at low speed - a pain to push around the garage. But on the highway there is no comparison. So much more power and comfort. On the air cooled bike I'm constantly looking for a higher gear. The 6 speed on the 120 is perfect.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Ask yourself what you want from the bike. Nobody really "needs" 1200cc's -- I have friends who have travelled coast-to-coast (several times) on a 200cc Vespa. With a passenger!. It used to be that 600cc's was HUGE. Then 790 Bonnie's were the cat's meow. Then 865 was a big engine. Now we have 900 and 1200 (and the absurd Rocket with 2200cc). Unless you weigh as much as a car, you don't really "need" that much power. I've ridden my son's Street Twin, and it definitely has acceleration and to spare. I'm sure the T120 has even MORE acceleration, but I'm not sure I really want or need that much power. The saying "give them enough rope to hang themselves" comes to mind as I envision myself careening off the side of a mountain because I went crazy with a bike that had more power than I really needed or wanted.

So you don't "need" a 1200cc bike, but maybe you "want" one -- that's a different matter and that's fine, to each their own. But don't fool yourself into thinking "gee, only 900cc's, no way I can use that for anything but putting around town". Just ain't true -- it's plenty of power to do whatever you want.

Whichever you choose, you'll come out ahead. Even my "slow" 865cc Bonnie can do the ton and scare the crap out of me when I let it!

-Dan

EDITED to add: Read the book "Main Street Africa" if you don't believe me. The author rode from Johannesburg South Africa to Cairo Egypt on a 650cc Bonneville in the early 60's, fully loaded with gear and surviving the heat, rains, dusty roads, border guards, and wildlife!
 
#9 ·
Ask yourself what you want from the bike. Nobody really "needs" 1200cc's!
True but we should not run away with the idea that the Triumph 1200cc engine is some rocket ship with more power than is required. It has more power than the old Bonnies but it is also a fairly docile bike by current standards. Today's regulations and real world torque requirements have led to larger bore engines that are often less powerful at the top end. A combination of the weight and road tuned engine means the T120 and new Thruxton are slower than a lot of old 600cc bikes.

So I would say try both new bikes and an air-cooled model. All three right give you the level of grunt you want, equally you might find none will, only you will know.
 
#8 ·
According to Cycle World, the T120's weight is up 23 lbs from the 2016 T100. I think you can account for nearly all of that weight with the T120's factory installed center stand and low grab bar.

The T120 is the far more capable bike, with its greatly improved handling, power, shifting, comfort, and that much needed sixth gear. Don't forget the T120's dual front disc brake setup, sorely missed on the T100.

Apparently there's no gas mileage penalty for the T120's 1200cc engine; gas mileage is actually up from the T100. With my T120, I'm seeing right at 60 MPG day in and day out.

I seldom use all of my T120's power, but it's there whenever I want it. Plus, there will never be a combination of weight, altitude, and road grade that will bog down the bike.

So, it just comes down to the purchase price. The T120 costs more, but much of what you might later add is factory installed. Plus, you get a far more capable bike.
 
#11 ·
For me the 6th gear, extra front brake, and more relaxed torque were all worth it. Would I like 20lbs less weight, for sure. But I don't really feel it while riding, only when pushing it around the garage.
 
#14 ·
I owned a T100 for about a year before trading it in on a T120. As said before, the T120 is better in most every way. The T120 with that 1200 motor is just loafing along at 70mph in 6th gear. It really makes this a do it all bike that can be used for commuting or touring. I think the handling was also significantly improved and the bike just feels planted and stable. The brakes are vastly improved and the added features including the updated clocks, riding modes, heated grips, fit an finish just make the extra 1K a no brainer IMO.
 
#16 ·
I am surprised that so many posters find an extra gear a positive option. I find that on longer journeys excessive gear changing is just tiring. One of the features of the Street Twin that I really like is that once clear of urban areas and twisty back lanes it can stay in 5th all the time. 5th is still an overdrive ratio as far as peak power is concerned but the engine has so much torque it remains very responsive at any speed over 60 mph. Unfortunately its not practical to skip gears on a sequential change but when driving my six speed car I almost always skip some of the gears and sometimes even skip two when traffic or speed limits prevail.
 
#27 ·
I find that most of the time I don't get past 5th gear, but it's nice to have If you find yourself running down the interstate for any significant distance. Just another reason why the T120 is so versatile and enjoyable. I think the T100 got fairly buzzy at 70mph and above, but the T120 is not even breaking a sweat at 70mph. I prefer backroads where the speeds are between 60-70, but again, it's nice to have the 6th gear in reserve when needed.
 
#17 ·
In my observations, more people who buy the less expensive (less power) bike trade up to a larger bike than the other way around. Are you going to wish you had the T120 if you get the T100? Would you have this voice in the back of your head saying "it was only another $1,100 and I would've had a (perceptibly by you maybe) better bike." Think about your riding, do you like to hot rod around? I'd get the T120 if so.
 
#18 ·
While the 900cc Street Twin engine certainly has plenty of power, I purchased the ST because I like it better than the T120 - looks, ergonomics, weight distribution, etc. They are very different bikes. The new T100, on the other hand, is essentially a T120 with some different options and less displacement - There isn't much reason to like it better than the T120 other than the price.

Ultimately I think the power delivery of the 900 is awesome and more than adequate, but I suspect you'll wonder 'what if' and secretly lust over the T120 if you end up with something else.
 
#21 · (Edited)
There is no "perfect bike". No one bike for all occasions. Certainly a T120 makes a better two up touring machine than an ST, but there are many others in the tour category that exceed the t120. Just like there are many sport bikes that excel on track more than the ST. But the ST is a good all rounder !

Check out the video - 9,200 miles long term assessment of the track day owner from previous video.

 
#34 · (Edited)
There is no "perfect bike". No one bike for all occasions. Certainly a T120 makes a better two up touring machine than an ST, but there are many others in the tour category that exceed the t120. Just like there are many sport bikes that excel on track more than the ST. But the ST is a good all rounder !

Check out the video - 9,200 miles long term assessment of the track day owner from previous video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdjlTHakoN4
Man, that bike is beat to hell.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Thank you for all the input so far!

I don't think 2-up riding is going to even be an issue- my wife refuses to ride any bike with anyone at any skill level, so it's going to be Lone Wolf action for me. That alone tells me the T-120 is probably a bit of overkill. (I even fell on my sword and offered to bolt on...yes, a sidecar for her and that got me The Look again.)

As for my riding needs, it's mainly a daily commute- 30 or so minutes each way- and the occasional weekend day trip or group ride if I find a decent crowd to hang with. So, not really any need for 0-60 in .3 of a second. I do want to be able to ride to the beach every so often- that's a good 4-5 hour stretch for me, but I'm an insanely law-abiding driver/rider :D (I've 'done the Ton' a long time ago, so that's been out of my system for a while!)

As much as I'm being drawn to the shiny new w/c T-100, I'm also looking at the fact that (as some have noted) the older a/c T-100's are still very capable bikes in their own right, and I agree that older does not always mean obsolete by any standard (and, if the truth were known, I like the styling of the older T-100's over the new ones). And as we get closer to '17, I expect the prices on the older bikes to drop even more.

I suppose- again, as noted by you guys- there's going to be a Test Ride Weekend in my future to settle this issue.
 
#23 ·
Thank you for all the input so far!

...

I suppose- again, as noted by you guys- there's going to be a Test Ride Weekend in my future to settle this issue.
If you can, test ride the Street Twin. It's pretty affordable for a new bike, and has the modern features that are actually useful, like ABS, traction control, light assist-clutch, slip clutch, maybe cruise control, better brakes, better gas mileage, tubeless tires, etc., etc. And it feels lighter which is a plus if, like me, you have to push it out of the garage every morning to commute to work. I love my carbed 2007 Bonnie, but if the Street Twin had been out when I was shopping for a used bike, I probably would have ended up with one. Yeah it doesn't LOOK like a classic Bonnie, but it has a lot going for it regardless.

-Dan
 
  • Like
Reactions: wachuko
#24 ·
Contributors to this thread are at different stages in their biking lives. Personally I've done the 150 mph superbikes ( OK probably never got above 140! ), and the myriad of tiny engine Japanese screamers, and the scary Kawasaki Z1 production racer, and the pure circuit Desmo Ducati ... etc. etc. So now I only want 50 HP delivered from an enjoyable rumbling twin with modern brakes. Its about what experience your looking for right now.
 
#25 · (Edited)
besides what was mentioned ergos are an important factor, taller riders will be cramped on the ST, prolly similar to my base 2012 mag wheeler, young + limber it may not matter + unless you test ride an hour or so you will not notice that! a plus for an air cooled bonnie is simplicity + lots of cheap upgrades out there NOW!!! $500 will get you excellent 6 piston braking + 1G for bitubo fork cartridges + a pair of great shocks for your weight, installation xtra $$ unless DIY. even though the 1200 has better suspension parts if you are bigger + ride double changes may be needed + the new water cooled bikes parts are much more $$$$. like my maggie the ST may handle better because its lower with less unsprung weight, its smaller lighter wheels make a difference + of course easier to fix flats on the road!!
 
#26 ·
I bought a street twin this month as my first bike. I didn't wanted to go with a 1200 as I tough it was too big of a bike for a newbee. After only a few weeks, I'm sorry i didn't get a Thruxton instead. Between the T100 and T120, I would go with the T120. But I love my ST


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#31 ·
6th gear on the T120 is a total waste, unless you are cruising at 85 mph - and good luck holding on for any real distance. When I bought my T120 last year, I think I really lusted after the Street Twin, at least in terms of less weight and smaller engine. I really wanted a "T900", or the ST engine in the T120 frame, with twin clocks, twin disks and the rest. I love the T120, but I think the perfect bike is the T120 frame, but with the 900 motor. Of course, with 60+ mpg, it isn't too much of an issue, and changing the sprockets will bring the motor down into a more usable range for normal riding. If the new T100 Bonneville only had dual disks, it would be close to the second perfect bike for me at least. The most perfect bike I ever had in my life was my 70 Bonnie, which my daughter rides now alongside me on the T120.
 
#32 ·
6th gear on the T120 is a total waste, unless you are cruising at 85 mph 0.
We're all biased by the high revving natures of our previous bikes, and we tend to miss the point of the T120's engine and gearing. The next time you're just cruising at 60 or so, nudge the gearbox into sixth and just enjoy. Look what it does for your indicated MPG, yet virtually all of the torque and power are still instantly at hand, without shifting. Yes, it's a lot different from what we're used to.

There's simply no need to be looking for higher RPM in any particular gear just for the sake of higher RPM. Changing the bikes sprockets to achieve this only cripples the bike's top end, narrows the gearing, and means shifting more often.
 
#37 ·
I have a 12 Bonneville a 16 120. Trust me, you want the torque and 6th gear. The bigger frame takes a couple hundred miles to get comfortable, then you are. Sure the lighter bike might be better on a tight, twisty road. But if that is your focus the Bonnneville might not be the right bike too start with.
 
#38 ·
You need to identify in your mind what type of riding you'll do- short commute, long commute, short hops, weekend twisties, long distance? ANY Bonneville will do most anything well enough, except 400 mile days on an interstate IMO.

Buy the most bike that you can that fits you if money's no problem. If you're on a tight budget, may I suggest a lightly used recent model year air cooled version is the best bang for the buck. I just bought a very lightly used showroom condition '14 from a dealer for almost half off of the original MSRP.
 
#44 ·
The T120 is certainly a better value if you factor the far greater torque, the front dual discs, the center stand and the heated grips.
If I were in the market for a 900, I'd be more interested in the Street Twin with its lighter weight, Brembo brakes and higher tune. Or the Street Scrambler.
If one is atracted to the style points of the T100, they need to skip straight to the T120 without passing GO. The price differance is minuscule for the aray of additional features.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top