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Twins Technical Talk Technical Talk for Hinckley Triumph Twins: Bonneville, T100, Speedmaster, America, Thruxton, and Scrambler.

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Old 11-30-2012, 04:48 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by greenocktriple View Post
Had same probs on my 2012 efi thruxton ,wil try the fast idle start from now on see how it goes ,but getting fed up with it, might need to go back to speed triple !!!!! Or even consider a jap bike again after 12yrs with triumph.........triumph need to get this sorted
I did try the choke-out start thing several months ago. It still did it.
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Old 12-02-2012, 09:44 PM   #82 (permalink)
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Crank it

I have measured my starter motor resistance. 0.01 ohms
When calculating the purely resistive inrush current of the starter, the value @ 12v would be 1,200 amps, but the circuit would not see this magnitude as the resultant impedance of the circuit would quickly restrict it and as I measured the min of 7volts at initial start the value would be 700 amps. So one can see the battery can be under enormous stress at starting. Again it would be nice to log the volts versus current versus time, but this test equipment is not available to me.
On a different note the ECU abort start threshold voltage is not the only issue.
I ponder thinking it is more a time issue. eg the duration of time the ECU detects the voltage being below the setpoint whilst starting. (purely speculative). Anyway thats all the time I'm spending on this one, I gotta' go for a ride.
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Old 12-05-2012, 05:52 PM   #83 (permalink)
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Does any one know if Triumph officially monitor this site. You would think that it is the perfect tool for them as we are all a massive 'Test Team' on the world 'Test Track'. Be good if they could address some of these issues though!
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:39 AM   #84 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by moth View Post
Does any one know if Triumph officially monitor this site. You would think that it is the perfect tool for them as we are all a massive 'Test Team' on the world 'Test Track'. Be good if they could address some of these issues though!
Regards
Moth
I seem to remember Prop saying that they did although I've not seen any evidence of that in the shape of the odd comment or helpful hint from them. We don't even appear to have any trained official mechanic contributing, a pity as their first hand experience and access to technical update documents would help.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:56 AM   #85 (permalink)
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I use the choke when I first start my bike for the day or if it is cold, but I will go by the book to see if it helps. I am going on the record as saying though that the choke should not have anything to do with this problem. I'm not an engineer so I can't say for certain but I do think I have a fair amount of technical skill.
+1. Having subscribed to this thread and keeping up with it, I thought I'd try the suggestion to use the 'choke'. Since it's pretty cold around here now (26 this am!), I've been using the choke on startup. No problems at all.

I'm a new rider and just got this bike in April of this year ('12 T-100). It seemed that the starting issue wasn't there in the first couple of months., and as the bike 'broke in' it started happening intermittently.

But as it's been said (and I'm no engineer either) I think there may be something that Triumph could address. I don't think it should be necessary to use the 'choke' in the warm months. I don't mind having to use it in the winter, but when you think about it, EFI cars don't require you to use any sort of choke or primer. I don't know why this EFI bike does.
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Old 12-06-2012, 11:03 AM   #86 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Forchetto View Post
I seem to remember Prop saying that they did although I've not seen any evidence of that in the shape of the odd comment or helpful hint from them. We don't even appear to have any trained official mechanic contributing, a pity as their first hand experience and access to technical update documents would help.
I smell the influence of their legal department.
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:27 PM   #87 (permalink)
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I don't mind having to use it in the winter, but when you think about it, EFI cars don't require you to use any sort of choke or primer. I don't know why this EFI bike does.
Cars and bikes with more sophisticated EFI systems do it as well. The difference is that they have what is called an IACV (Idle air control valve) which is motorised, automatic and controlled by the ECU.

This valve lets some air bypass the throttle butterfly valve to raise the idle speed when cold and also to maintain the idle steady as high power accessories are switched on or off, like air-con, heaters, etc.

The Bonnie only has a manual IACV which takes the form of a "choke" knob. This is mainly for economy of manufacture.

The correct starting procedure is given in the handbook, I quote:

• If the engine is cold, pull out the choke, noting the following: Above 25C air temperature, pull out the choke to the first position. Below 25C air temperature, pull out the
choke fully.

If the engine is partly warm, pull out the choke to the first position.

• Leaving the throttle completely closed, push the starter button until the engine starts.

Last edited by Forchetto; 12-06-2012 at 03:30 PM.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:01 PM   #88 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moth View Post
Does any one know if Triumph officially monitor this site.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forchetto View Post
I seem to remember Prop saying that they did although I've not seen any evidence of that in the shape of the odd comment or helpful hint from them. We don't even appear to have any trained official mechanic contributing, a pity as their first hand experience and access to technical update documents would help.
I have no doubt that Triumph monitor this site, they would be crazy not to, but I fully understand their "hands off" approach to this forum. Dealing with angry owners on a public forum would be a PR nightmare for them.
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:00 AM   #89 (permalink)
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Same Same

My 2013 Bonnie has the same problem with starting. I had TORS fitted when I picked up the bike and after a couple of days it had a lot of trouble starting. Ends up the wrong engine tune was loaded into the bike. Now, it has the occasional 'one-turn' false start and then kicks over. Annoying, but not devastating. I am starting to realise why the Bonnie was so much cheaper than my Ducati. Just saying.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:00 AM   #90 (permalink)
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i can live with that!

@ Forchetto - thanks for the additional detail.. it all makes sense to me, and heck, if they say use the choke then i'll just do what they say. and - Surprise! No "strange starting issue" after all!
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