Triumphrat

PA-guy · 03-04-2006, 07:31 AM

I'm curious why people buy/prefer certain bikes and not others. This is not a survey to ascertain "brand loyalty" as much as it is to understand how people perceive certain brands.

I can understand why people would buy a Bonneville or R3 or a Harley as they are fairly unique bikes but when it comes to sport bikes why buy a Triumph or Ducatti or BMW when you could have any number of Jap bikes??? Maybe I'm wrong but everything I read tells me the Jap bikes outperform most any bike in their class. They are generally less expensive and are very reliable.

I recall reading a test they did involving a $33,000 Ducatti sport bike vs a $11,500 Jap bike, both race in the same class. They were close but the Jap bike won.

So, aside from appearance (although they all look alike to me), why do you think people would buy a non-Jap sport bike vs a Jap one? Might they be a little bias??????

03-04-2006, 08:07 AM

Here's my list...

1. Personality rating higher than absolute performance.
2. Wanting to have something that is a little more exclusive.
3. Brand name components on more expensive bikes.
4. Japanese bikes may generally be more reliable but not always as durable.
5. Plugging into an identifiable style or theme that is more convincing coming from a non-Japanese company (there are definate exceptions to this rule and this is not a race-based remark).

FattRat · 03-04-2006, 09:30 AM

With several Hondas under my belt, a few Yamahas, a Ducati, Moto Guzzi, Harley Davidson, BMW, and a couple Triumphs.......

I owned, performed minor services, put thousands of miles on them, and can conclude that I have no loyalty to any of them (obviously), but have enjoyed each and every one of them for what they were.

Some may have had more "soul", others were simply 'fun', and there were those that were endearing for their quirks. It's obvious to me now that there are certain brands that are over-engineered and will stand the test of time. Then there are those bikes that you simply rode, having never to do ANYTHING to them....... They can each and in their own way attract the attention of a different bystander who wants to talk bikes. Some of 'em can make you feel a little elitist, others like you didn't even exist.

With regard to performance, a person can sing the praises of a certain bike's handling characteristics. Though all fast/quick, some are quicker than others. And stopping power can vary significantly from one bike to another.

But they all is bikes.... and I likes bikes! I like them for their differences, not for their "superior" qualities. That having been said, the only bike that tugs at my soul & heartstrings is the modern BMW. I like it for it's Boxer engine torque, integral brakes and unique suspension, and for it's ability to stand the test of time and mega-miles. It's personality & soul can be likened to some of the best things in life, and sometimes that's a problem...... machines that perform and do their job so well that there is no drama involved.... can almost have a lackluster effect on you. The BMW made up for areas in my riding style that I completely lacked; it was THAT good. But like the 'perfect woman', 'perfect man', or the perfect job, you sometimes stray..... just to mix things up a bit.

I likes bikes, all kinds of 'em!

Tru2threez · 03-04-2006, 12:01 PM

Here here FattRat, I wished I had said that myself!!

Diego · 03-04-2006, 12:56 PM

> Maybe I'm wrong but everything I read tells me the Jap bikes outperform most any bike in their class.

If that's all that mattered, then you'd only need two or three brands to choose from, tops, because this month one of them could outperform all the others, but next month one of the other guys would come out on top.

Also, a lot depends on what you mean by "outperform." If you're talking sheer speed, that's one thing. If you're talking handling--well, the best in that category (last time I looked) isn't even Japanese.

And for that matter, this year's hottest performing Supersport model (once racers get acquainted with its unique properties) could very well be English.

But clearly, PA-guy, from your list of rides, you understand as well as any of us here that off the track, far more factors enter into buying decisions; and Japan Inc has no lock on those things: styling, tradition, feel of the ride, "personality," etc.

Even among sportbikes, which seems to be the thrust of your question--most of them are NOT sold for active competition, after all, so what difference does a few hundredths of a second mean to you or me? That's only "bragging rights." When it comes to "walking the walk," riders' skills make more of a difference than that.

Fortunately, motorcycling has not quite slipped into the Dark Age of Wal-Mart yet. There's room for products which provide different kinds of riding experiences, in different price ranges. Riders are not (yet) good little conformists, bleating our way like sheep into a big-box bike boutique, buying what one particular megaretailer has decreed the manufacturers must produce, at such and so price point, and which they expect us to buy because they've made sure it's the only choice we have.

We've got LOTS of choices, and they're not all about soulless numbers.

dazco · 03-04-2006, 01:12 PM

Triump because3....

1)-build quality
2)-design

Jap bikes are built with a lot of parts and paint that deteriorate quickly moreso than triumph. there are a number of jap bikes owned by people where i work and they aren't olde yet look like they're falling apart due to the paint and parts deteriorating. More plastic too. As far as design, i'm not talking about design as far as engine design and reliability, HP etc. I just don't like real modern motorcycle design, and except for the Jap V twins, which i don't prefer, most of them are sportbikes or modern looking "regular" bikes. I don't have a problem with personality that other cite so much except as it relates to looks. I can't speak for modern Jap bikes, but the ones i owned in the 70's i liked a lot and didn't find any personality lacking in how they felt. But the speedmaster is built well for it's price point compared to jap bikes and the design takes a more traditional path with a more custom look than a 70's jap bike. And i've just always loved triumphs ! If i were into V twins i'd stil not want a jap bike because if i was going to go that route i'd bite the bullet (as far as becoming "one of them") and buy a harley. Better quality by far.

Strontium · 03-04-2006, 05:17 PM

In 2002 I moved to a Triumph Daytona when it dawned on me that just because the Japanese bikes were faster and lighter it didnt make them any more fun to ride on the road. I think Triumphs biggest selling point on their sportsbikes is the fantastic triple engine. It really is an engine that is perfect for the road rather than the racetrack. What a sound.
I never did get the 600cc four concept even though the speed 4 looks cool but i think Triumph has a real niche with the triple.
I like the styling of Triumph and as I am British I get a certain sense of national pride whenever I hop on one. I also dont think they data as Quickly as the Japanese sports bikes that change just about everything every year.

neale · 03-04-2006, 06:46 PM

Hi, why buy a non-jap sportsbike as opposed to a jap sports bike? Because you buy what you want. Why does someone spend thousands on something like a 750 Commando race track bike and not on a big Kwaka. Because that's what they want.

Silverado57 · 03-04-2006, 07:13 PM

The Jap bikes never appealed to me. I'm sure they're OK and all but they have no... soul.
We always Buy American in this household, but it appeared HD simply didn't need my $10,000+.

Plus, I fell in love with my Speedmaster.

I LOVE MY MOTORCYCLE!

:chug:

guzzi · 03-04-2006, 09:11 PM

Sounds like me and Fattratt have a similiar history. I have owned most all brands and styles of bikes. For me, the question comes down to the reason you own each particular bike, or the bike's mission.

If a bike's mission is narrow, a tourer, sportbike, dirt bike, or cruiser will be needed. If a bike must do more than one job, a more versatile machine is needed.

Add to this whether the customer is approaching his bike choice using strictly logic, or emotion. My personal choices usually included a japanese bike for strictly (logical)commuting, and one of the "archetype" bikes for (emotion) pleasure. Archtype bike?
One of the original engine configurations, and usually NOT one of the imitators.

For instance :

Guzzi NOT Cx 500 Honda

HD NOT Metric rigs.

BMW Not Concourse

Bonneville Not W650

It shows my prejudices, that I would rather be elbow deep in guzzi grease than ride a more maintenance free honda.
BUT, I need a commuter I can enjoy spending time on!

The Bloor Bonneville has the appeal of being an archtype design brought up to speed with some dare I say Japanese tech behind it. My hope is to maintain it like I would a Jap bike, (hardly at all) and enjoy it like a Guzzi. Make sense to anyone?