Triumphrat

aldtech · 04-26-2004, 01:48 PM

Update on Trophy 1200

The bike went in for break-in service and repair of the stall/bucking issue (gas starvation?) last Saturday, May 17. On Wednesday, 4/19, I was called and informed that bike was ready, then on Thursday, I was called again and informed that they are re-looking at the bike and may be a couple of more days.

On Saturday, 4/22, I call them (Naults Windham Motorcycles) to find out the status of the bike in hopes that I can pick it up that day. I spoke to the senior (I think) Triumph mechanic who also worked on the bike last year when it had the same problem. He states that he is the one who took it for a 2nd test ride and discovered that the bike was still having the same bucking issue as last year.

I am not going to go into specific details of what has been done other than that he is very well aware of the gas starvation scenario that has been problematic on some of the Triumph bikes and has checked all parts in question. Mechanics do not like being questioned about what they have/have not done. He further states that he is in contact with Triumph in an effort to get them directly involved in making a final resolution for what has been a continuing case from last year.

Naults had the bike for over 8 weeks last year and most of that time was spent waiting for Triumph to come up with things to suggest as a repair. It now seems that I am again in that same holding pattern.

Here is a re-cap of the bike’s history.
· I bought the bike as a new (’01) leftover model last year, beginning of June (’03) with 26 miles on it (give or take?).
· I ride it sparingly until July (’03) when I take an Advance Rider’s Course where the bike seems to overheat on me and totally craps out, stalls at every stop and bucks almost continuously. Quite an embarrassment while trying to complete the course.
· It sits until the end of August when I finally determine after numerous attempts at starting and riding it that it is not an over heating issue that should have gone away when cooled and I take it to Naults Triumph.
· It spends the rest of August, all of September and most of October of 2003 before I finally get it back with no real description as to what was wrong with it other than it is working now.
· The bike does not get ridden until I put it in storage in November (’03). It seemed to run well then as it did when riding it back from the dealership the previous month.
· The bike is taken out of storage the 7th of April (’04) and when riding it home starts to exhibit the bucking/stalling problem again.
· On 4/16 when I try to ride it in to work, it completely dies like it ran out of gas but has ¾ of a tank full. I manage to get it back home by running it on reserve and the next day I take it back to Naults (on reserve, it will not run on prime or on).

This bike has less than 500 miles on it and most of that was riding it to and from a Triumph dealership. I have almost absolute faith in the mechanics at Naults as I have met them and feel that they are truly motivated towards their customers and their bikes. But as you can guess I am quickly loosing faith in the bike I bought.

The purpose of this post is not to slam Triumph and/or their dealerships but to help me formulate a strategy for a win/win situation between Triumph and me. As it stands right now I am heavily leaning towards demanding that they replace my bike if they cannot fix it within a reasonable amount of time (DAYS not MONTHS) along with compensation for loss of product. I have always had apathy for people who have done this but now that I am on the receiving end of a failed product I now know what they go through.

I am asking you the reader that if you know of a direct link to Triumph USA, either phone or email, that could you please pass it along to me. I am also hoping that someone associated with Triumph USA is reading this post and might get directly involved thus eliminating the run-around I am surely going to go through as I press my case.

You can email me at adoucet@hotmail.com with any contact information you might have or simply post it here if you feel that it is information that everyone should have. If you are from Triumph you can/should get my cell phone number from Naults Windham Motorcycles, their Phone number is (800) 867-7220 (Closed on Mondays) and feel free to contact me.

It is not my immediate plan to pursue this right now as I do want to give the mechanics more time but I just want to map out my options in order that I can be ready for a confrontation. I do not want to pursue this through the dealership because they are not the ones who sold me the bike and I feel that any action to be taken should be through Triumph directly as they ultimately are responsible for their product.

Thanks in advance for your support in this matter and any help anyone can offer.

AL Doucet
:???:

MickMaguire · 04-27-2004, 10:12 AM

The person you want is
Peter Carlio (at the Newnan, Georgia office)
678-854-2010

He is very hard to get hold of though, very overworked and his name is known on so many of these boards I think he is snowed under.

Once you get this bike back, take it from me stop taking it to Naults and try Great Bay over at North Hampton. From other stories related to me about this dealership, and reading your chain of events, I would conclude that this is not a problem with Triumph it is a problem with Naults. If it were me I would collect the bike and trailer it over to North Hampton.

[ This message was edited by: MickMaguire on 2004-04-27 08:15 ]

aldtech · 05-11-2004, 02:47 PM

Update

Three weeks in the shop and it still is not fixed.

:evil:

MilwFreddy · 05-11-2004, 05:31 PM

I just got my bike back after similar (identical) problems and equal frustration levels. I realize you have probably heard this, but opening the fuel cap slightly while this happens will pinpoint whether it is a fuel venting problem. It worked for me and the culprit was the much discussed rollover valve. I haven't had any problems since . It is easy to diagnose and it should have been one of the first things to look at. Good Luck.

aldtech · 05-21-2004, 11:17 PM

Got call on Wednesday saying bike is ready. I had called Triumph USA last Friday (4/14) requesting help or my money back and they where not very nice nor helpful. Now all of a sudden my bike is fixed and again they can not clarify exactly what the issue was. Hmm, I'm wondering if it is just a ploy to get the bike out of their shop. I will find out tomorrow, Saturday (5/22). If it starts bucking and or stalling again back it goes.

[ This message was edited by: aldtech on 2005-02-03 10:34 ]

MickMaguire · 05-24-2004, 10:01 AM

Do yourself a favor and dotn take it back to them if it is still playing up. Take it over to Great Bay instead.

aldtech · 05-28-2004, 06:01 PM

Well, I picked up the bike yesterday (5/27) and it runs like a charm. Again they still could not describe exactly what the fix was so I will just list what they did:

1-Removed carbs and checked float hight
2-Replaced plugs, apparently had the wrong ones installed.
3-Checked gas cap
4-Checked coil
5-Replaced fuel tap Assembly (pet*****)
6-Re-gaped exciter coil

It was not until they re-gaped the coil that the bike ran normally but even then the mechanic said that he did a bunch of stuff at the same time and could not pinpoint what exactly made the repair.

It took them just a month to get it back to me this time but they broke my left-front turn signal (they tried to hide that) and chipped the left side of the fairing. I am never bringing my back to them again.

Later,

AL

06-23-2004, 01:57 AM

It's hard to believe that a problem that almost every Trophy has is not diagnosed properly by most dealers - mine included. I had mine in 3 times and finally gave up on the dealer. When I decided to diagmose the problem myself, the cause and cure was obvious.
The problem is the fuel petcock is held open in the run and reserve positions by engine vacuum, which is taken from the left (usually) carb vacuum port. Due to a poor design, the end if the vacuum port nipple on the petcock comes very close to the frame backbone. As chance would have it, Triumph doesn't do well at telling their assemblers where to route things, including the main wiring harness that runs down the frame backbone. On mine, and on many others, the wiring harness is run exactly in line with the vacuum port on the petcock. In other words, the harness is between the end of the nipple and the frame.
So what happens? The wiring harness usually leaves possibly 1/8 inch of clearance if it's routed this way. Which doesn't leave any room for the vacuum hose to come off the end of the nipple and bend out of the way of the wiring harness. So the vacuum hose is pinched off. On mine, there was just a tad of vacuum that got through, which means just a tad of fuel got through. Going up hills, it was pretty starved. Sometimes it would stop running just going down the road, especially with less than 1/2 tank of fuel. Prime was the only cure, which doens't require vacuum. Mostly, it just ran terrible and I was unhappy.
Once I discovered the issue, I rerouted the main wiring harness down under the frame backbone, and made sure when I put the tank back on that there was enough clearance. Even with moving the harness, there is barely room for the vacuum hose. However, the bike now runs great. Always.
A couple of other things. While you're under there, dump every piece of hose that Triumph put on the bike. It's pure junk. I dumped most of the vacuum plumbing and just vented the carbs to the air. Bypassing the relays and cannister. The relays can fail and cause problems. Replace the fuel supply lines with the best aftermarket line you can find. The gray stuff that is similar to stock Honda line will last longer than you own the bike.
I guess the reason this is rarely diagnosed is you have to look when the tank is on the bike with a flashlight. If you do, and you know what to look for, the problem is comletely obvious. If you take the tank off, there's nothing to see, so you'll never find it.
If your dealer accidentally moved the wiring harness, the problem would have gone away seemingly w/o a reason.
Hope this helps, you and others with this problem.

07-01-2004, 05:35 PM

I've seen a lot of posts concerning the vacuum line problem. Is this a problem that happens after a certain amount of miles or something that is there from the start?

I bought my '99 2 months and 1,600 miles ago ( she now has 14,500 miles on her) with no problems so far. I'm just wondering if this is something to "look forward to".

10-28-2004, 03:52 AM

Well, you probably won't see this. Sorry I didn't check back in July. The vacuum line pinching issue isn't one that crops up over time, ie from age. The fundamental issue is some of the assemblers of the bikes at the factory didn't pay much attention to where Triumph wanted things routed, most especially wiring harnesses. So, if your bike was assembled by one of the offending folks, the wiring harness that runs down the main backbone is potentially in the way, almost in the way, or not far from being in the way of the petcock vacuum line. Mine was in the way, almost but not quite completely pinching off the vacuum line. So mine had the problem from the start. Remember, the vacuum line was almost pinched off, so there might have been a couple of inches of vacuum on the petcock. I tested it with a vacuum pump, and that would barely open the petcock. With a full tank, there was enough head pressure that there was enough fuel flow to run the bike. Not great, but it would run. With 1/3 tank, there wasn't enough head pressure. But it would sometimes run. My guess is that's because the tank can move around just a small bit on the mounts, and so sometimes the pinch was a bit more than other times. Again, for me, I had 3 times when the bike would refuse to run. Now, knowing what the problem was, turning the petcock to prime would solve the problem. I did try that on at least 2 occasions, but my petcock as it turns out on prime doesn't flow very well. So what would happen was I'd try putting it to prime, it wouldn't start, and probably just being dumb, I'd put it back where it was supposed to be on run. Do that a couple of times and you convince yourself it won't work on Prime either, and never try it again. Dumb me.
So, the right thing to do is one day when you're bored, look under the left side of the tank with a flashlight, and see if the vacuum line coming off the petcock angled at about 45 degrees to the front is anywhere close to the wiring harness on the backbone. If it is, yank off the tank. move the wiring harness up or down the backbone to a place where you know it won't be in the way, and put the tank back on. While you're there, replace the fuel lines. You'll probably find they're already cracked. Mine were. 3 years. Triumph uses rubber that has a very short life, I found.
Now, there is ample evidence in other posts that some people also have trouble with the tank cap or overflow valve not flowing enough and the tank will develop a vacuum, which will also cause fuel starvation problems. Some remove the tip-over valve. Some modify the gas cap to be vented. Mine has never had a problem with the cap not venting, that was one of the first things I checked, and I've never had any vacuum in the tank.
Greg