Triumphrat

dazco · 07-28-2005

I've been going crazy trying to determine what pipes to get, what i should or shouldn't do to the airbox, whether to rejet and if so how, and a million other questions. And no matter how many time people tell me "hey, it's easy to rejet", i can give you a lot of reasons why it's not till you've learned all the tricks. And the infinate combinations of mods and parts makes for too much confusion.

The biggest problem with trying to follow advice here is that you have a few different twin models and a dozen or more different pipes, and everyone goes about it differently. So there is no set way to go about tuning a given bike/pipe combination. So i suggest a member database in which members can submit thier stats including bike model/year, what non stock parts it has and what mods and what settings and jets were used. Then a comment section where they'd be prompted to offer thier description of how the bike improved, how much it improved, dyno numbers if available, and a general description of the overall ride and performance compared to the stock bike.

For example, say you have a bike like mine, a 05' 856cc speedmaster and lets say i want staintunes. If we had a member base of tuning stats then i could go there and look into those who have an 05 speedy and staintunes and see exactly what jets he used and any other info. And if his comments show that the bike has improved immensly and there are no negitive affects, then i can go with those pipes,jetting and settings and know that i'm going to be close if not right on the money, WITHOUT having to go thru a long tedious tuning process.

Bonnevilleamerica.com has one, i know. But it's nothing like i described. It offers little to no information. Most submissions don't even add comments and are virtually worthless to those reading them.

To sum up, what would make this valuable are these 2 things.....

1)-a COMPLETE description of EVERY detail thats been changed over the stock bike including and most importantly jetting.

2)- a COMPLETE and detailed description of how the bike runs compared to the stock bike....power/torque increase and any negitives such as popping or dips, etc.

Knowing exactly what the person did who has your same bike and pipes and got results that meet your needs/desires would allow you to make the same changes with no guesswork and end up with what you want, bypassing what in many cases (from all i've read here and elsewhere) a long tedious process that probably deter many from going for it ! I know it's definatly detered me which is why i'll probably go with thunderbike pipes due to the "no rejetting" they advertise. But even then if there were a base like this i could see what those who DID rejet and do air mods with Tbike's got out of them.

I know this probably won't happen because one lowly member suggested it, but still i just had to see what others think. Maybe, just maybe, if this gets a lot of good response someone will at least consider the possibility. Maybe it's just me, but the way i see it this would be absolutly invaluable, more so than anything i've seen on this site or elsewhere.

Rat_bastard · 07-28-2005

Great idea! I would add altitude also, as this will affect proper jetting.

Whisperinsmith · 07-28-2005

dazco,
I too think it's a great idea. I've been reading your posts since you joined and appreciate the level of interest you have to improve your bike and this forum.
One addition to this forum I'd love to see is to make it easy to "include" an image, a picture to our posts. For example, I'm one who installed the Thunderbike pipes. I could have posted pictures of each easy step and the only adjustment I had to make (the mixture valve). I know others have access to a website to post images and then refer to them so they show here. But there has to be an easier way.
PS I can relate from your prior posts to how you tortured yourself over the choice between the America and the SM. i went with the America and love it, but I'll never know... I'm already thinking of purchasing the Wiseco 904cc Big Bore kit. You can't imagine how much I've spent AFTER I purchase my bike. But that's for another post. Please keep up your level of pleasant proddings.

derek985 · 07-28-2005

With regard to performance improvement, loudness, etc. - these are subjective items without a dyno and db meter testing equipment. I'd like to see a db for this type of thing as well but we would need a way of taking the subjectiveness out of those specific things.

BTW, this site offers photo hosting through the photo album feature. Once uploaded to your photo album I believe you can just link to the url on this site where it's hosted.

[ This message was edited by: derek985 on 2005-07-28 10:25 ]

dazco · 07-28-2005

Quote:

With regard to performance improvement, loudness, etc. - these are subjective items without a dyno and db meter testing equipment. I'd like to see a db for this type of thing as well but we would need a way of taking the subjectiveness out of those specific things.

I agree. But still just a complete description of all changes and an accessment of the performace changes both negitive and positive would be great. At the very least just knowing the exact changes to make and knowing there are no ill effects and a definate improvment would be good enough. As it is now you have know way of knowing where to start to assure no popping or other problems and a definate performance increase no matter how subjective the increase is. At least you'd know that theorhetically doing the exact same thing to the exact same bike with the same pipes would almost surely give you a boost and no problems. And for me thats all i could really ask for.....just the facts. But subjective descriptions are as you say just that. Dynos would be great as i i too noted, but of course thats sorta wishfull thinking because most people aren't going to do that. But thsoe who do, yea, that would be even better.

Quote:

For example, I'm one who installed the Thunderbike pipes. I could have posted pictures of each easy step and the only adjustment I had to make (the mixture valve). I know others have access to a website to post images and then refer to them so they show here. But there has to be an easier way.

Absolutly. Pics would be that much better. A dedicated section for pics that would be posted in each member's "tuning profile" would be awesome !

[ This message was edited by: dazco on 2005-07-28 11:22 ]

Thrux-ton-up · 07-28-2005

This is a good idea - there are numerous jetting data base threads floating around in the forum- but hard to track down when you need them. I had to rejet 7-8 times to finally hone in on the best set-up. A data base would have gotten me closer sooner. Maybe the webmaster could set up a site that stays right at the top of the threads that everyone can post in - like they have in the cafe bike section with the thruxton and thunderbird owner reviews. JCW

cal6n · 07-28-2005

Really good idea. I proposed putting a spreadsheet together purely for dyno readings at various states of tune last night in this thread but a full relational database would be much more useful.

XLR8yourmac.com has had one running for compatability between various Apple computers and hardware upgrades for some years now and it works really well.

dazco · 07-28-2005

What i'd like to see is a similar format to what bonnevilleamerica.com has, but with the info i described. In other words, a drop down field that lets you choose your bike, then one to choose the pipe. Then you submit and it shows you all the members who have posted a tuning profile with your bike and pipes.

ChuckBecker · 07-28-2005

A user database of modifications and results is an awesome idea! The big question is how to quantify results, I think. First, noise level, how do you measure it and what is the character of the noise (pleasant, irritating, ear-shattering, etc)? Second, dyno numbers are easy enough to come by but where I live cost about $90 for a dyno run, and worse yet, every dyno is different.

Is there some real world performance measure that's tolerably easy to take and reasonably predictable that would be meaningful?

Perhaps 50-90 top gear roll on, before and after? (measured on a private road, naturally...).

dazco · 07-28-2005

Quote:

On 2005-07-28 14:38, ChuckBecker wrote:
A user database of modifications and results is an awesome idea! The big question is how to quantify results, I think. First, noise level, how do you measure it and what is the character of the noise (pleasant, irritating, ear-shattering, etc)? Second, dyno numbers are easy enough to come by but where I live cost about $90 for a dyno run, and worse yet, every dyno is different.

Is there some real world performance measure that's tolerably easy to take and reasonably predictable that would be meaningful?

Perhaps 50-90 top gear roll on, before and after? (measured on a private road, naturally...).

Actually my initial idea wasn't so much to deal with loudness or exact amount of performance increase. It was more a matter of simply being able to know that by using a person's tuning profile you could be almost sure to end up with a setup that doesn't have any negitive effects and does have a performance increase. True, trying to quantify thr results of performance increase would be hard going by one person's subjective description. But that's not what i was aiming at because as you and a few others have said it can't be quantified without at least a dyno.

The person's description of what kind of increase would at least be helpful. I mean, if a guy says he's not sure but it seems like it may be a bit stronger, you can be pretty sure it didn't add another 10 HP and 10 lb's of torque. on the other hand if someone says it's a whole new bike and just screams you can be fairly sure it did add at least a worthwhile increase.

but again, the main purpose the way i see it is simply to know exactly what to do in order to be assured of no negitive affects and that the bike is running correctly with no popping, dips, idling problems, overheating, etc. That right there is to me the most important factor along with SOME increase in performance. w/o a dyno of course you'd just have to hope the person's idea of what is a big or small increase is in line with yours. But i think the biggest problem is being able to find a point of tune where the bike runs perfectly. And i believe this idea WILL address that and work quite well. And lets face it, even w/o the persons description of the increase he got you know that when aftermarket pipes and air mods and jetting are done, if the bike is running perfect it's going to have close to if not AS big an increase as you can expect from those pipes anyway.