Triumphrat

Awesome Tiger

Hi everyone, i am new to this whole forum thing so please be gentle with me as i have a few Q's

I have an 03 Tiger 955i with the Triumph race can and a power commander (USB3) that the previous owner had installed, but have been having a few niggling issues lately and am considering replacing the race can and PC with a Tuneboy.
The dealer seems to think that the ecu is fighting with the PC causing running and fuel efficiency issues! (might even be a dodgy O2 Sensor eliminator or iridium plugs!?)
Note: also has a K&N air filter with restriction plate removed.

The odd thing is, although it seems to running rich, the plugs seem to show its running on the Lean side !

Have many of you experienced economy issues? my last tank didnt even reach 300ks !

Replacement Exhausts: What do you recommend???
Has anyone fitted a Remus PowerCone on a 955i ? ive seen one on a 1050 which looks cool and sounds even better ! i can fabricate a bracket to fit if required, but can anyone see any other issues that may arrise ??

Can anyone recommend any other replacement?
Just can or complete new headers too ?

TUNEBOY:
Anyone know if the Tuneboy is a great deal better than PC? Should i keep the PC as well?
and if its best to have or remove the O2 sensor eliminator (currently fitted to resolve surging issue)
At least with PC you get a box to plug in for the money you pay!!
Although $200 for a tuneEdit key is good value, i cant see where the other $300 goes!! surely the cable doesnt cost that much !!

Lastly, anyone with a Tiger live in Brisbane? would be great to hear from you, compare tips & tricks and possibly go for a ride

Pickaxe

Tuneboy has got to be the way to go. It does far more than the PC in terms of other service related areas and it actually programs the ECU, rather than trying to fool it into providing altered fueling, as the PC does.

My advice, ditch the PC and first of all fit an O2 eliminator, which is about £20. That will address all the low speed/constant throttle surging, which is the only noticeable driveability issues with the engine.

Depending on your finances either get a Triumph dealership to download the 'off road' tune (£20-£30) or buy a Tuneboy £230. This will give you nearer to the perfect fuel/air ratio and make the engine feel smoother and slightly stronger.

If you feel the need for a louder exhaust this will give the IMPRESSION of more power and will piss the neighbours off.

Plenty more information and opinions on the subject can be found on the forum.

Awesome Tiger

Hi Pickaxe, yeah i fitted the O2 sensor a few weeks after i bought the bike, best investment although, i have read a couple conflicting feeds suggesting that although it fixes the surging, the ecu no longer gets reliable data and could therefor be causing issues like high mpg! ??
My argument there would be 'what about aftermarket full exhaust systems' ? they dont have anywhere to plug in the sensor!!!

i also supposedly have latest race tune from 1st service.

completely agree on Tuneboy too, makes much more sence to edit the source, but not sure if it will solve the current issue of fuel consumption.

its weird cause the plugs are almost white (suggesting Lean) yet the fuel consumption is now higher!! even after i leaned off the PC !

when i look at the PC fuel mapping, there are areas that have quite a few % more fuel added which is to be expected, so seems odd that the plugs are still so white!

My b*tch is that ive serviced and dyno'd the bike twice, and it comes away awesome with over 400ks per tank even while fanging around, a couple weeks later the bike still runs fine, but i lose mpg!!

my dyno guy said that iridium plugs tend to foul more often than standard which could be causing the intermittent miss/roughness and he noticed a tinge on the race can where the cat is, suggesting the cat is getting hotter than norm and could be causing issues ??? hence the new straight through can thought!

Might be time for Tunedit first, i believe it does diagnostics too that might shed some light!
either that or look for fuel leak !!

Pickaxe

Even if the O2 sensor isn't installed into the pipes, the ECU will still be looking for a value and would need to be eliminated. I've read that you can simply unplug the lead to the sensor and not install the eliminator. However, I'm more likely to believe that Dynojets product is providing the ECU with a slightly modified reading.

IMO, these days, spark plugs always seem as if the fuel mixtures are weak. I think it must be the unleaded fuel we now use. They also seem to last longer and never need adjusting. I'm sure I was always checking the plugs on cars I owned in the 70/80s

The MPG thing has been widely debated. I have to say that in the case of my 06 Tiger, the O2 eliminator and off road tune make no or very little difference to the fuel consumption. My bike returns 50 ish MPG (imp) if I ride at, or just a bit above the UK speed limits on highways and other fast roads. If I thrash the nuts of her, it can drop into the low 40s.

I think that reported MPG varies more on riding style than any other factor. If you're a rider that can read bends and doesn't hold on to the lower gears for comfort, your MPG will generally be better. I've spent many years training motorcyclists and when they pull up at the pumps and fill up, the extra fuel they've used is dramatic, considering all the bikes are identical.

Regards

Pickaxe

Awesome Tiger

I found a site to make your own eliminator!
http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/i...ic=20350&st=30

seems its just a 330ohm resistor!

i think the engine light might come on if there's no connection?

Yeah, I know what your saying about riding styles, but i actually find i often get better economy fanging around! ive been keeping a fuel log and at last refil i only had 5-6 Ltr left in the tank but only travelled 230 ks of town and freeway cruising! thats less than 30mpg or 8.25L per 100ks!!

after both dyno's i got 5.6L per 100ks, 42mpg both times during 1 days riding hitting 200 kph!
ive never got anywhere near 50mpg so something definately not right there.

even a work collegue with full staintune system gets regular 500ks per tank (no PC or K&N though)

i have a feeling the K&N filter and air box mod may be sucking in too much air, or perhaps air leak elsewhere, which could explain white plugs, and i guess if an air sensor is reading high air the ecu would compensate for ratio and supply more fuel. When dyno'd its set for that days atmospheric conditions and high speed dyno run, but when cruising around the ecu changes the figures but the PC is still set as per Dyno

i have even zeroed out the PC map a couple of times to see difference, but noticed a greater performance drop than mpg gains ! (didnt like having to put in more effort for wheelies!!)

Kinda makes the Tuneboy sound like the next logical step to take next !

miker

Welcome Awesome.

Might be time to start from scratch and see what you have. Install the correct tune from Triumph for your model, remove the PC, remove the O2 eliminator and go to a standard pipe. This will give you a benchmark to work with.

If it's extra HP you are after, how much do you weigh and are you prepared to lose weight? Remembering you will rarely use the additional overall HP, but you may well use any gains in torque and driveability.

Once you have established a base, work up from there, but leave out the PC, it's more than likely one of your problems.

You also asked why the Tuneboy is so expensive? Intellectual property. It's taken Wayne and a number of other motorcycle and computer boffins may years to develop this system and whilst the cable may only be worth $20, the results it gives you are far greater.

Have fun sorting it out!

Mick

__________________


My Album

"We may not be able to change the direction or strength of the wind, but we can always trim our sails"

Awesome Tiger

Hi Mike, thanks for the welcome.

its not necessarily about the HP gains, but if a nice looking lighter replacement can / full system provides it then why not!?

I am only 75ks and trying to put a little on!

I am actually currently happy with the performance of this bike with current mods, and especially when freshly dyno'd!
its the inconsistancy that frustrates me at the mo.

i can be merrily riding/fanging along, then an occasional bigger squirt and it'll hesitate and splutter as if its missing then come good again (leading me to think its those iridium plugs again?)

and then of course the inconsistant fuel enonomy!!
it often smells rich and the fuel disappears, but the plugs are lean and i get de-acceleration pops not gurgles.
id just love to be able to know that in general use/cruise mode (up to 15% throttle) i could safely assume 500ks per 24Ltr, but i can't, i could understand if i was full throttling, but im not doing that either! the tiger has plenty of torque and go, that i rarely open up over 70%
around 40% in first and the front lifts

will take your advice though, i was lucky enough to be given the stock pipe as well when i purchased the bike, so might put it back to stock for couple of weeks and make one change at a time from there out.

Me thinks that Tuneboy is the go too, id much rather edit the source than manipulate it after, at least with that i can also diagnose and compare settings, plus i really do like this bike so intend keeping it so Tuneboy will get used a few times, plus im sure i'll get something back for my PC !

Kiwi Tiger

When I read these posts I think im glad I have a stock bike. It runs fine, is quite quick when I grab a fistfull, I dont have to change down a gear to pass something, it goes a long way on a tankfull of gas.

Good luck to you guys on making the improvements. I have had bikes and made the "Mods". It cost me a lot of money for little gain.

At the end of the day if you want a bike to do someting, like 300 kph or so and handle like a F 1 bike, just but the bike from the floor and enjoy it.

Just my 2c worth.

Awesome Tiger

Hmm, think your missing my point here, I purchased my Tiger second hand with the mods already made and am more than happy with the extra responsiveness and power gains over what 'Standard' supplies but didnt expect to get such large diffenences week to week in fuel economy.

its not that im trying to make my Tiger into a race bike, i just want it to be the best it can, a crisp responsive set up with good MPG at cruising throttle, and sharp power when needed (at a little fuel expense)

your qoute: "It cost me a lot of money for little gain"
ive never noticed 'very little gain' from even the simple mod of drilling out stock exhausts to allow quicker exhaust release, you'll be surprised at the difference it makes.
Just remember that manufacturer's hands are tied due to emission control these days!! why would they bother even making a race can?

All is good and well when/IF it all runs perfect from day dot, however, as you will find in many a forum, nearly everyone notices the surging issue due to emission control, which is a very undesireable quality for any motor as running too lean will cause more damage than good, so a little tweaking can actually be better for your ride

For me i believe i have found something going astray even after servicing and dyno's, which may not actually be a result of the mods but simply a bad batch of fuel, dodgy plugs or even an air leak etc!

ive actually not even found anyone reporting PC's failing, but id be better of disconnecting it for testing rather than just zeroing it out like i did before and still got cr*p mileage!

miker

Interesting to note that I was recommended a Wurth Injection Cleaner, which has shown to cure water in the fuel from a bad batch. It's good stuff and worth using every so often. BTW, it's not one of those available at the gas station (which we know mostly don't do much) it's only available at your local dealer from what I can gather. www.wurth.com.au and search Injection Cleaner.

Mick

__________________


My Album

"We may not be able to change the direction or strength of the wind, but we can always trim our sails"