19" Front on XC, is it possible? - Page 2 - Triumph Forum: Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums

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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 12:47 PM Thread Starter
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I never considered the ABS issue. Thanks for clearing that up.
Next, is getting some seat time on a Tiger.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktiger View Post
Honestly Norty, I don't know why you continue to post because you clearly have no idea about anything to do with Motorcycles.
The ABS unit is calibrated for each individual model, through extensive testing, according to wheel size, expected tyre grip and all sorts of other parameters. If you change a significant part of that equation, as you would be by changing wheel sizes, then the ABS would either kick in far too early or, maybe, not at all.
The only way around that problem on the Tiger800 might be to fit a "roadie" ABS unit when fitting the 19" front wheel. BIG emphasis on the "might".
So, you just stated the same thing I did (only differently) and you tell me I don't know anything about motorcycles?

BTW, the ABS unit isn't calibrated for "expected tyre grip."

Traction Control is another matter...

I'll be sure to read your posts so I can become educated via the internet....

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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-12-2012, 08:18 PM
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The problem with the ABS is the system uses both the front and rear sensors in order to detect slippage at either end. So..., if you swap the 21" for a 19" the system is going to detect the 19" wheel is now turning faster which can trick the ABS into thinking that the rear is closer to locking up than it truly is.

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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-13-2012, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NORTY FLATZ View Post
BTW, the ABS unit isn't calibrated for "expected tyre grip."
You don't reckon?

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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-16-2012, 08:48 PM
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The ABS braking system sees each wheel indpendently, kind of. The front wheel ABS will see the rear wheel as spinning and keep the front from locking. The rear does the same. Now, is there a
certain, magical ratio that the ABS needs to function? No. Not really. No, it won't "reduce your engine's torque."

However, ABS will lengthen your stops, so don't depend on it to help you out of a bad situation. That's what your training is for.

Also, for you lane splitters that have to deal with BOTTS dots, disable your ABS PRIOR to lane splitting.

Go ahead and experiment with your ABS whilst riding over BOTTS dots. You'll find your braking ability is NONE. Okay, maybe not "NONE", but darn little. Dangerously lacking.


Back to the topic: Sure, you can have a 19" front wheel on a bike that has a 21". The issues I have typed above still hold true, but you can do it.

Do it and let us know how it worked for you.


BTW, back in 1974, I changed a 19" front tire to a 21" on a Yamaha, and it made the bike understeer on the dirt. (It was a dirtbike.) It was a mistake, unfortunately, but I was stuck with it as I had limited resources to modify my bike. Paper routes weren't as lucrative as they are now...

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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-17-2012, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NORTY FLATZ View Post
The ABS braking system sees each wheel indpendently, kind of. The front wheel ABS will see the rear wheel as spinning and keep the front from locking. The rear does the same. Now, is there a
certain, magical ratio that the ABS needs to function? No. Not really. No, it won't "reduce your engine's torque."


Also, for you lane splitters that have to deal with BOTTS dots,
Think you're getting ABS mixed up with traction control. ABS has nothing to do with engine torque.

*** are BOTTS? Battle Of The Twins?

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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-17-2012, 05:23 PM
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*** are BOTTS? Battle Of The Twins?
That should read "What the phuq". There, spelt it the polite way according to Billy Connolly.

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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-18-2012, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktiger View Post
Think you're getting ABS mixed up with traction control. ABS has nothing to do with engine torque.
You're right. After re-reading what I wrote, I can see how confusion could arise. Sorry 'bout that, Chief!

*** are BOTTS? Battle Of The Twins?[/QUOTE] "Botts" dots are those little plastic hemisphereical pieces glued in between lanes to alert drivers of drifting into other lanes.
Since lane splitting/sharing riders likely run over these "dots" they can play havoc with ABS as our systems are still in kindergarten (relatively speaking.) They're even more treacherous when wet or icy.

Hope this clears up what "Botts" dots are.

The guy who invented them was named "BOTTS."

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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-19-2012, 04:23 AM
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by NORTY FLATZ View Post
WTPhuq are BOTTS? Battle Of The Twins?
"Botts" dots are those little plastic hemisphereical pieces glued in between lanes to alert drivers of drifting into other lanes.
Since lane splitting/sharing riders likely run over these "dots" they can play havoc with ABS as our systems are still in kindergarten (relatively speaking.) They're even more treacherous when wet or icy.

Hope this clears up what "Botts" dots are.

The guy who invented them was named "BOTTS."
You're talking about these http://solutions.3m.co.uk/wps/portal...tiveRoadStuds/ but I'm afraid us Brits got there first with "Cats Eyes". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat's_eye_(road) These work brilliantly (Pun, sorry) but, as you say, there's a big lump in the middle of the road which can make things squirrelly.

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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 12-19-2012, 11:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktiger View Post
You're talking about these http://solutions.3m.co.uk/wps/portal...tiveRoadStuds/ but I'm afraid us Brits got there first with "Cats Eyes". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat's_eye_(road) These work brilliantly (Pun, sorry) but, as you say, there's a big lump in the middle of the road which can make things squirrelly.
Those are different from BOTTS Dots, which are non reflective domes ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botts%27_dots

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