Worthless 1050 ST Power System Factoids

[CLB]

Readers digest version---no problem found. I don't believe anything in this thread will help you make your 1050 start quicker. Except maybe a TOR pipe and remap.

Interested in cold start threads and being a person of the aircraft power system persuasion, I decided to look for 12V power bus issues during startup. The thought being that starter current draw possibly pulls the bus voltage low enough that the ECU/Injectors/Coils provide marginal functionality.

I measured bus voltage during startup with a digital storage oscilloscope (scope) at the always live spade lug feeding the engine control (front) relay.

The scene of the crime...


Here is a scope photo of bus voltage during startup. Note that the bike started in 400ms or 0.4 second. I probably don't have an issue.


I then proceeded to solve the problem I didn't find. I added a 56000uF 16V 105C capacitor between chassis (at the forward relay bracket bolt) and the input terminal to the ECU relay.
I wrapped the cap with two layers of shrink tube, filled the ends of the shrink tube with hi temp RTV and mounted the cap to the relay bracket with zip ties.
Here is the scope photo of the "fixed" power system bus.


Here is a shot of the mounted capacitor.

The large box in place of the flasher relay is a self canceling "signalminder" box. I am not sure how happy I am with it. Canceling before the timer runs out (lane change) is clumsy. The internal packaging looks like a recipe for moisture issues. I conformal coated the board, drilled drain holes in the bottom and sealed the top.

[speedjunkie]

THAT looks like alot of work. Personally, I wonder if the starting problem is more along the lines of the injectors leaking off into the cylinders. Generally notice it's the first start and subsequent when sits for 30 minutes or more, yet fires right up if only sits for a few minutes. Sort of acts like it's flooded. Yep, that's what mine does.



Mike

[triumphite]

Neat work.

My bike has had sub-par start up since the day I brought it home a year ago. 12,000 miles later, fires up exactly the same way as it did from day one.

I used to be concerned about it, but it hasn't gotten worse, so I figure it should be ok.

[ruscook]

I was given the answer on this board by Gavin from Qld.

1) Crack throttle about 1/4
2) Thumb starter
3) as engine cranks release throttle
4) engine fire and away we go.

This method has reduced cold starting times for a 5-7 sec crank to a 3 sec crank EVERYTIME. I only open the throttle when she's cold but it does work!.

Russ

[gallowglass]

My question to those who complain of cold start problems is this. Is it really a "problem" or is it just we've all become so used to everything instantly responding, that every minor delay now focuses our attention on what doesn't work isntead of what does.?
This is a great bike that is very enjoyable to ride with a unique sound and a very responsive engine. It will do more than most of us a capable of asking, so why focus on the negatives?
Personally 3 seconds, 5 seconds or even 10 seconds isn't enough of a delay to make me want to fix something thats not preventing an actual start.
Now if you were to crank until the battery went flat and it still didn't go, then that would be a problem.
No offense intended to anyone just my 2 cents worth.

[ruscook]

I understand where you're coming from gallowglass.

The only reason a fix is "preferred" is a 7sec cranking shouldn't be needed on a fuel injected bike. Particularly as the bike ALWAYS "takes" or runs as soon as it fires. So if you use the throttle control method to make the engine fire much earlier I think of it as a useful technique, that does meet my expectations in this era of instaneousness :-) , and potentially a battery preserving technique or at least one good for when the battery is a bit older and doesn't have as much oomph (technical term here) in it.

No biggy either way, but it works and my bike fires up with everyone elses I ride with, not way after

Russ

[gallowglass]

Russ
I agree with you about the throttle open stuff I do it automatically anyway having come from the bad old days when instead of cranking you were kicking.
But as you said it starts anyway even if after a delay, now I agree if it won't start then thats a problem.
I was only suggesting this may be one of the bikes little quirks and we should just get on with enjoying the whole package.

[ruscook]

On 2006-08-20 07:42, gallowglass wrote:
I was only suggesting this may be one of the bikes little quirks and we should just get on with enjoying the whole package.

No probs, that's how I took your comments.

And yes you're 100% spot on here. There's a few niggly things, but with the bikes being about $2K cheaper than their Japanese competition it's still a great package overall, and nothing beats the triple motor :-)

Russ

[dalebuna]

My '06 always takes at least 3 seconds to crank -- A bit annoying at times, but I always forget about it as soon as that triple comes to life....Dale

[Gavin]

Rus
I'm glad to see it still works for you mate.
I have got it down to under 2 seconds crank time when cold. I am much happier not hearing that starter motor winding over for soo long.

cyas