breaking(lapping) in a new engine

[jeffro]

Very informative I just hot 500 miles on my Sprint, it still sound tight

Jeffro

[4N099]

I am sticking to the posted break in rpm's and mileage schedule suggested by Triumph and my dealer told me that you could exceed the suggested rev's by 1000 occasionally and that after 400 miles you can pretty much ride it however you want to. Which I sort have been doing anyway within the guidelines and it seems to be working well.


I have always been the sort that listens to and tries to feel what the engine is doing when I break something in and will push the revs up to where the engine feels like it is starting to get tight. Nothing excessive but just testing the revs. No wide open, no massive rolls on the throttle just gently coaxing a little more rpm's when running it up before a gear change.

In the case of my Sprint it was difficult to keep the engine at 3500 rpms for the first 100 miles since from about the 30 mile mark the engine naturally went to 4K in acceleration and wanted to run above 3500.
I've been using the engines heart, so to speak, to let me know how far I can go and it's pretty much as the dealer said, 1000 over the rec's is where the engine wants to be in all the phases of it's "mileage" chart that I have reached.
Which isn't far, I've only got a few miles under 500 as of today.

I am fortunate like Dolson in that we have a lot of hills around here.
My favorite in particular is the road going up from the dam to the high road.
That hill has to be a 30% grade for about 1/4 of a mile.
I took it up the other day and the Sprint pulled like a team of mules and didn't even breath heavy to third gear and stayed below the rev limit on the tank. I've been doing that all week after work on the ride home.

Since day one I've been running it up just below the max rec rpm for a short time and then backing off and cruising a little and have been when the opportunity presents itself, coming down from 6th and shifting into 4th or 5th for a short time and then running it back up to speed if I am having to go more than 10 miles at a "constant" speed.
I don't know exactly what Triumph considers "don't run a constant speed for a long period of time" but my outings have been runs of less than 12 miles where you would have to run at any kind of set speed and during the course I vary the speed anyway after 3-5 miles.
There are a lot of roads around here where you have small towns approximately 9 to 12 miles apart and that seems to work well since you can run it up and vary the speed in that distance and then are subjected to a through town cruise at about 30, so lots of shifting and running it up and down is what I have been doing and it seems to be working great.

I have made a couple of faux pas moves like yesterday, got on the interstate and was wrong by one gear in what gear I was actually in and hit 70 and cruised that way for a mile or two before I realized I was in 5th. But the motor was only running about 4400 so no harm no foul.
As the miles get put on I have noticed that every day that I ride the bike you are able to cruise at X rpm in one gear lower than the day before. The motor is loosening up really well.

I came home from Columbia last night and took the four lanes, sun was down and the valleys were nice and chilly with a 15 degree drop in temps when you dipped into them and I took the opportunity to run it up just below the 6K limit for a short period a couple of times.
The engine feels very strong, I've been getting better gas mileage every day that I ride it, almost 47 mpg up there and about 45 coming home with a couple of 95-98 mph runs in there and I know 500 miles isn't a lot but the oil hasn't budged on the stick.

I agree with another post in this thread, it's not hard to break an engine on break in or cause problems later on, but I think you really have to have your heart set on abusing that motor.
That is one reason I wouldn't buy a used HD these days. Too many people buying them who've never even owned a motorcycle before in their lives.
Back in the late 80's when the yuppie discovery of HD took place and life as we know it changed forever, my immediate boss and the owner of the company both bought new HD's.
The big boss immediately took his out with 0 miles on it and proceeded to thrash it wide open.
3 months later his motor was making horrible sounds and 5 mechanics couldn't put humpty back together again.

My immediate boss was hard on vehicles as well and didn't heed my advice that HD's will to some extent use a little bit of oil and if he just kept his eye on the level every so often he would be fine.
He brought it back from Sturgis the first year and parked it and had our shop mechanic get it ready next spring and Larry called me over while servicing it and there wasn't a drop of oil on the dipstick.
Needless to say seeing what those two did to a couple of nice bikes burned me on used harleys from that point on.

Sorry to ramble. I get carried away sometimes.

[SEAsprintah]

what do you all think of this guy promoting "run it hard" break-in?

http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

At first I thought, any joe can post a webpage...doesn't mean anything. But I have to admit, if this guy can be trusted (which I don't take for granted), the piston photos look like convincing evidence.

[dolson]

what do you all think of this guy promoting "run it hard" break-in?

http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

At first I thought, any joe can post a webpage...doesn't mean anything. But I have to admit, if this guy can be trusted (which I don't take for granted), the piston photos look like convincing evidence.

This has been around and around and around. Basically one is betting that he is always right with all engines and that his knowledge is profound. I have built up enough engines, race and otherwise to know that what he says can be taken with a grain of salt.

It comes down to who is one going to trust that knows more about any particular engine? A shade tree mechanic or the folks that actually manufacture a particular engine. If following this guys advice one has problems such as oiling, valves, burnt journals whatever is this guy going to cover the rebuild?

Here, we have had folks that have had problems breaking in a fresh engine like this guy says.

The only thing he really addresses are the ring/cylinder wall area where now that is a very minor part of lapping/breaking in a new engine. Most ring and wall materials and wall surfaces are finished to seal almost right away. It's all the other components that one need to consider with and how tight (clearances) Triumph builds their engines a little more careful lapping in is required.

The English have always built their performance engines very tight. Before Ford bought Jag if you took a new Jag out and broke it in the way this guy advocates you would end up with a seized lump of metal in about 300 miles. No lie. You could get away with this in a Chevy but not something like a Jag.

My Sprint experienced several times where I could tell it was freeing up. 700, 1500, 3500 and 7500 miles. These were the areas where I could tell things were happening. Almost like a switch was thrown.


So, do what you wish, I do and am thoroughly happy with the way my engine has turned out.

Don

[rodneybrown]

Mr. Dolson repeats post #1 of this thread and I refer you back to post #3. I don't buy motoman hook line and sinker, but there is some CYA in break in specs too. These bikes aren't an XKE, thank God. Metallurgy and machine tools have come a long way since then.

[machtuck]

Just bought a "new" 2007 Sprint and had a question about break-in oil. THe bike is being shipped from New York to Atlanta and has 38 miles on it (probably from test rides) and was going to change it before I ride it.

JUst called the dealer and they said that they put Triumph Mobil1 synthetic 10w30 for break-in oil. Does this sound right? Is there a cheaper oil (such as rotella) that I can use until the 500 mile service? The dealer said use 10w30 for break-in and then 10W40 for use afterwards. Any ideas?

I am assuming that the 38 miles that are on it were ridden pretty hard since they were test miles and probably from someone with no intentions of buying the bike. Oh yea, it's black! Previous bike was a Yamaha FZ1 which had incredible power but thought that the Sprint was probably a better built bike (shocks, brakes etc). Hope that I am not disappointed.

Dale

[rodneybrown]

Just bought a "new" 2007 Sprint and had a question about break-in oil. THe bike is being shipped from New York to Atlanta and has 38 miles on it (probably from test rides) and was going to change it before I ride it.

JUst called the dealer and they said that they put Triumph Mobil1 synthetic 10w30 for break-in oil. Does this sound right? Is there a cheaper oil (such as rotella) that I can use until the 500 mile service? The dealer said use 10w30 for break-in and then 10W40 for use afterwards. Any ideas?

I am assuming that the 38 miles that are on it were ridden pretty hard since they were test miles and probably from someone with no intentions of buying the bike. Oh yea, it's black! Previous bike was a Yamaha FZ1 which had incredible power but thought that the Sprint was probably a better built bike (shocks, brakes etc). Hope that I am not disappointed.

Dale

This has been a point of multiple questions over the years and not a whole lot of absolute facts available. On two new Triumphs, 02 ST and 04 RS my dealer/mechanic said don't be in a rush to put in synthetic. That implied the break in oil was not synthetic. That is the point that really isn't certain. I do know that on 955's the Mobil 4T Racing recommended by Triumph for operational use was NOT what was used for break in. Despite my disagreement with Mr. Dolson on break in, we do agree, I believe, that dumping the oil early on in the break in is a good thing. I think we also agree not to rush the synthetic even though our reasons may not be the same. If you do dump the oil an extra time or two up front along with changing the filter, IMO you will have long term benefits. IMO the difference between 10W30 and 10W40 over the relative short period of the break in period won't make a whole lot of difference AND just to make it perfectly clear, once you start an oil thread, don't expect to get anything but conjecture and opinions.

[jellero]

i broke in my sprint by the book, exactly but just bought a new bike, a (gasp) 2008 kawasaki ninja 250, which is a blast. i've read motoman's ideas and others. i made up a check list of my own. first ride, 5 minutes, then the next four not over 10. i took bike up to 8500 (13000 redline), then back to 5000, over and over for 25 miles in lower gears. lots of engine braking. then changed oil and filter which were loaded with shiny specks of metal. i've been riding more aggressively, touching redline a few times. heat is the threat to a new engine, not rpm's. it has a one year warranty. the manual says under 4k for the first 500 miles. 4k is like 38mph... j

[Calliway]

Yes heat is the enemy to breaking in an engine but the reason why they tell you stay under 4K for the first 500miles is because rpms create more heat through increased friction.