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Keyless Ignition - Part Trois (et demi!)

34K views 63 replies 18 participants last post by  DEcosse 
#1 ·
So - this is "Keyless Ignition - Part Trois"

Now that the Sombra supplies from the 'Part Deux' model appear to be exhausted - have not been able to find any recently - had to come up with another system based on new donor module.
(there may some isolated Sombra units out there but hard to bank on at this time)

See this thread for previous details on the 'Part Deux' - Sombra based model
(includes video demo of operation which is essentially same between the two systems)

So I had to find an alternative. I wanted to have the same core feature, it that it would not only serve as being 'Keyless' but also hands-free.
Hands-free of course means not having to actually remove the remote from your pocket or press the function button, but just have it detect/enable when in proximity of the bike.
I recently got a Directed 2102T PKE (Passive Keyless Entry) to play with as it appeared to meet the fundamental criteria



There are pluses & minuses vs the Sombra.

Plus - EXTREMELY compact; readily available;

Minus - is inverted logic - has active 'armed' signal rather than active 'dis-armed' (which Sombra has as configurable option); no on-board immobilizer relay or lamp flash outputs; only one remote per kit; a bit more expensive.

The latter two in the 'minus' column are not really show-stoppers. But does mean if you want these features, you have to add couple of external relays. (you could argue however the KeyLess as a whole is anti-theft)

To deal with the inverted logic of the 'Armed' vs 'Dis-Armed' active states I had to revise the control circuit.
The remote needs some special attention also: When the remote is in proximity of the controller, it flashes the remote continuously; there is a provision on a car for a remote battery saver however, whereby you press the brake and it turns off the remote; then when car door opens it resets it back on.
So I had to figure out how to turn on/off the remote (bike has brake but no doors!) and also not only latch the ignition output, but also the trigger from the 2102T.
So all of that is integrated into the new control board and remarkably even my prototype still fits inside the incredibly small 2102T enclosure.
I discovered that if I tied BOTH the brake & 'door open' input triggers to the 2102T to the ignition output, as soon as the ignition is set (by pulling clutch lever, same as before) it would turn off the remote and conversely turn it back on when the ignition latch is dropped. No need to tie externally, all comes together at the module!

Here is block diagram of the new controller (the 'Armed' input - now an inhibit rather than an enable):




And here all buttoned up inside the 2102T controller.



This one has a discreet LED harness for the 'Ready' state - it's for a non-Triumph.
On the Triumphs everything will come out of the small connector on the front and integrate through the OEM alarm connector and use the OEM alarm LED in the dash

Functionally, looking pretty good so far!
The kit actually comes with TWO antennas and a provision for an optional third (not included) - however one appears to be plenty for bike operation.
 
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#4 ·
Very interesting .

So will this wire up through the key switch and security connector ?
Any issues with moisture that makes its way under the seat for those of us that have no choice but to go out in the rain ? I know its not a lot . But I did note water stains in the battery tray when I was removing everything and cleaning up my many many extra wires under the seat .

I am still very very happy with my V2 and I am in no way wanting or needing an upgrade . Though the space savings are very tempting

Nice work as usual Ken !
 
#5 ·
.... Any issues with moisture that makes its way under the seat for those of us that have no choice but to go out in the rain ? ...
Well that is a problem with any automotive intended alarm accessory parts - they are not water-resistant in any way & intended for inside cabin installation.
This one probably easier to seal up than the Sombra which has a lot more spaces that open into the enclosure: the solution is to either hermetically seal it up completely (silicone or similar) or put it in another enclosure. Under the seat should generally be a dry zone.
 
#7 ·
Here is the latest revision based on the 2102T

Controller with Power Relays:



Controller - Plug n Play for Triumph

(Disposable Bic Lighter illustrates how compact this module is!)



D'Ecosse Control Board installed inside the 2102T



And the Control board itself



This board also includes a 'Ready' output (which for example can be used to drive a seat solenoid) and light flash output (flashes signals when arming/disarming as you leave/approach bike) and the status LED driver.
 
#19 ·
Well, yes - that is the basis for the kit - but as I said above that by itself is not enough. You need to have some auxiliary controller to go along with it.
In my case that is the latch control circuit represented by the block diagram in the first post and turned into hardware you can see in the pics in post 7 (3rd & 4th pics of the control board which I embedded inside the 2102T controller)

If you don't add the solid-state control board, you could possibly do something with a couple of relays* (in addition to the main power switching relays) using similar technique I showed as the alternative switching/latch control in the part deux revision.
* the problem with using relays for the control logic in this instance vs the part deux, is that in the case of the 2102T, the active output is when it's armed; which would mean you would connect to a normally closed relay that opens when you have it active (armed state) - that means the relay would have to be on all the time when ignition is off = power drain.
 
#20 ·
:smackglass: Okay I'd very much like to avoid unnessary drain with relays and I kind of get what you are talking about now. Again late browsing, hasty buys, sorry... I'm up to the challenge though and I could really use some help. It looks very technical. Anything to get my Tona to run again and stay that way. Is the circuit something I can make at home with parts from Radio Shack? I've never made a circuit from scratch and my only experience with circuit boards in general is re-soldering broken connections in my kids toys and the HDMI ports on the TV. I'd love to go to a Fry's but they don't exist in Massachusetts. One more reason I miss So Cal :(

-Just watched a basic tutorial from MIT on circuit boards and I think I can do it.
 
#22 ·
So I guess officially this next one is V3.5 :D

Hence thread title changed to Part Trois (et demi!) :D

The through-hole board was a little busy to get it shoe-horned into such a small area.
So I decided to re-design with Surface-Mount components.
I have actually improved performance in the process also - now it has dual drivers for the Turn Signals (separate one for each side) and all the Driver devices are now short-circuit protected which is a real bonus feature.
It utilizes some really sweet MOSFET drivers that are actually designed for the automotive market (hence the built in short-circuit protection)
But functionally, from the 'black box' perspective, is the same, regarding the hands-free operation and 'set' via the clutch lever.

This one is going on a Rocket3.




 
#24 ·
Keyless Ignition - Part Trois!

Functionality is essentially the same operationally from a 'black box' perspective
- there are a few nice advantages in
a) the size - the complete controller is only about 3" x 2" x 3/4" - so takes up a lot less room than the big Sombra box.
b) The Remote has better power-saving circuitry - only flashes when it's in proximity of the controller and turns off again once ignition is energized.
c) the output devices now have short-circuit protection.
d) I like the remote battery preserve control better - no need to 'shake' to re-awaken; the latest one automatically shuts off/on when out-of/in range of transmitter - vs timer/motion accelerometer of the Sombra
 
#28 ·
Keyless Ignition - Part Trois!

... No problems at all .,.

I have a Sombra-based system (like yours NT & DG) on an active-duty working police bike that has seen almost daily duty with multiple frequent starts throughout the day for about 18 mos now - so reliability at least of that system shouldn't be in question

The V3.5 has some nice designed-in elements but doesn't yet have such extensive field reliability data (although I'm confident will be just as solid)



Sent from Motorcycle.com App
 
#30 ·
And one more enhancement - I can now add an immobilizer into the equation
That can be optional feature as desired.

If attempted hot wire of the ignition circuit takes place, the relay will energize and open the circuit unless the Remote is within the active range. So replicates the OEM Alarm system in this capability - except of course it disarms hands-free as you approach, no button to press (the only thing missing is the noise-maker - no loss there IMO!!!)
Indeed even if the key is used, the immobilizer will still kick in unless the remote is also present.
There is no risk of the immobilizer coming on when riding - the system uses a normally-closed (unenergized) relay for normal operation; as before the remote goes into 'sleep' mode once ignition turned on, so does not rely on communication between remote & controller once the ignition has been turned on legitimately (i.e. with the remote in range initially)

This extra feature does not add any additional connections to be made to the bike - still essentially same as the original hook-up (although the intermediate connectors are slightly larger as require more positions); but the additional feature is all self-contained within confines of the kit in how it interfaces to the bike i.e. through the alarm connector and the 6 Posi-Taps.
It adds slightly to the size of the relay block of course but not prohibitively

This one is a Rocket3 Kit (with Immobilizer) - the Rocket Alarm connector is under the tank so needs an extender harness (same with OEM Alarm)

 
#48 ·
as before the remote goes into 'sleep' mode once ignition turned on
How are you getting it to activate the 'sleep' mode? The manual says that the doors need to be closed & the brake pedal pressed.

There are '+' & '-' inputs for the doors, and a '+' for the brake.

I'm thinking the door '+' could just be set when the ignition comes on. And probably the brake '+' as well, though you could get fancy and actually tap the brake light on the bike for it as well.

But, how does the remote wake up? Just by opening the door sense circuit when you turn the kill switch off?

thx
--Dan
 
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