Triumphrat

Tbirdnz · 10-05-2008, 10:48 PM

Many riders may be doing this automatically but I occasionally see bikes coming around sharp corners where the bike is on their side of the road the the rider is leaning over into my side of the road. This doesn't matter when I'm on a bike as there is sufficient space, I tend to tuck into l/h bends and avoid the road centre but if I am in my 4WD or there is a truck coming along then there is a good chance of the rider getting his head knocked off.

To explain the difference in riding around corners I have borrowed this off another web site for explanation:

The standard method of approaching corners is to start on the outside and then move to the inside of the turn at its middle or apex. From that point to the corner’s exit, the rider can drift outward again, effectively straightening the corner. This is the so-called race line and is the shortest way through a curve. When visibility is good and you can see all the way to the exit point, this is the best way around a curve. When obstructions exist, this method may not be optimal.

One technique that experienced riders use to maximize their sight-lines is called delayed apex. This means the rider remains on the outside part of the curve through the corner until they can see the exit point. By staying outside, they can get a better view of the road ahead and this provides additional time and space to react to potential hazards.

Of course all this depends on the speed you are hitting the corner, delaying your turn means your turn or lean angle may be sharper. Approaching the corner at the correct speed should take into account your sight-lines around it.

Anyone care to add to this observation ?

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Ride on !

Outrunner · 10-06-2008, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tbirdnz;1130487
[I

One technique that experienced riders use to maximize their sight-lines is called delayed apex. This means the rider remains on the outside part of the curve through the corner until they can see the exit point. By staying outside, they can get a better view of the road ahead and this provides additional time and space to react to potential hazards. [/i]

That is the correct way to ride bearing in mind that you must make allowances for wide vehicles coming towards you, or nutters cutting corners. You should always ride at a speed which allows you to stop in the distance you can see.

Andy.

saphena · 10-06-2008, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outrunner

That is the correct way to ride bearing in mind that you must make allowances for wide vehicles coming towards you, or nutters cutting corners. You should always ride at a speed which allows you to stop in the distance you can see.

Andy.

+1

in the case of single track roads (not enough room for two vehicles to pass) "... allows you to stop in HALF the distance you can see to be clear" - otherwise you and a "safe" rider coming the other way will meet in the middle!

Tbirdnz · 10-07-2008, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outrunner

..... You should always ride at a speed which allows you to stop in the distance you can see.

Andy.

I've known that since I was a kid and read about it often but I'm afraid I go around corners far faster than I could stop if there was an obstruction. This particularly applies to left-hand bends where you can be sightless. For right-hand bends you have a clearer view. (Read opposite for US riders).

If I rode with some of my mates and they were following they would be ramming me if I observed that rule.

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Ride on !

Outrunner · 10-07-2008, 09:31 AM

Notice the use of the word "should" in my post.

I have to admit sometimes I am going a bit too fast to stop safely in the distance I can see to be clear.

Andy.

saphena · 10-07-2008, 03:10 PM

Here's a video of a UK police biker showing/telling us how it should be done.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=3Yqyv7XR1kU

Tbirdnz · 10-07-2008, 05:28 PM

Good vid Saph, I think we'll put that in the Stickies later.

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Ride on !

drewdebut · 10-20-2008, 01:52 AM

The best insight on delayed apex turning I've found is from a book called Proficient Motorcycling. It really helps me to have diagrams to illustrate points. I try to scan through the book every now and then to keep the concepts fresh in my mind.

oldretrorider · 11-13-2008, 01:02 PM

I think a lot of people try for the standard method but are actually turning in too soon. You realize this only as you're exiting the turn and find that you're running wide, which can get hairy if you're running out of road on a left turn or running into traffic on a right turn. It's very tempting to start turning too soon and hit an early apex because you have all that road, and the apex is often beyond your line of sight when you start the turn, so you think it is closer than it really is. Most of the time when I try for the delayed apex, I end up actually doing a standard turn.

I'm still trying to train myself to do a real delayed apex because I think it is a lot safer. On real roads you often cannot see the entire turn and don't know where the apex is, what is around the corner, or how the road changes (it could be decreasing radius, increasing radius, or a hodgepodge). The delayed apex gives me a margin of safety, and as soon as I can see through the turn, I can start applying throttle to smoothly and quickly exit the turn.

HiDesert · 11-16-2008, 08:11 PM

Even if you know where the apex is and exactly what comes next, you still don't know what weather, animals, and other drivers have deposited on the road since you rode it last. I got a wibble from the back end today on one of my favorite roads because of some fine gravel. That's one reason you never ride 10/10ths on the street.