Triumphrat

DEcosse · 10-08-2012, 03:31 PM

Good man!

The fact that it 'barks' with some fuel in the TB's suggests potential Fuel Delivery issue;
one thing you have to be careful of, is running the pump with the Fuel lines (at least the supply) disconnected - the Regulator is after the return, so if pump turned on with the outflow hose disconnected it will dead-head into the sealed fitting. This can rupture an old hose, or just blow it off the filter fitting (which is not uncommon)
One test you can do to establish pump is flowing, is to disconnect the RETURN feed and place in a jar; turn on ignition and pump should flow at pressure for that 3 seconds.

spendo · 10-10-2012, 11:24 PM

thanks, i put it back together and it ran for about 2 minutes, stopped cold.
checked everything, connections have power and voltage as before.
jumping the fuel pump terminal with battery 12V+ & (-) yeilded nothing.
no fuel pump running, used a mechanics stethascope. all quiet on the western front.
or at least on the fuel tank mounting plate.
meter shows continuity across the terminals, so there is a connection to the fuel pump motor winding. dang, i just replaced the fuel pump (bike sat for a couple of years with evil gas in the tank). looks like i'll have to get a new pump. Error codes read bad relay and bad fuel pump.
also read bad sensors, but i have a power commander on it, do you think the sensor readings could be distorted by the power commander?
i better check which sensors have the power commander overide circuit on them before i waste your time by asking you this question.
thanks for your insight and generous help.
best to you
ts

DEcosse · 10-10-2012, 11:30 PM

There are no sensors connected to PC only the injectors
Remember that pump needs not only +12 but ground too
On the t595 ground block issues are common

Sent from my iPhone using MO Free

spendo · 10-12-2012, 11:17 PM

thanks
i jumped the fuel pump to bat + and bat - both to make sure i was bypassing any ground issues. no go. i guess i'll take the pump out and see what i see.
thanks again
i'll send a question on the error codes next, after i go plug in my laptop.
TS

DEcosse · 10-13-2012, 02:37 AM

If you have a winding reading through the pump electrical connector, I would believe the pump is OK
You don't really hear the pump, it's the regulator releasing that you hear, on the return line.

You said you had error code from the pump/relay - if you clear, does it come back?
Note that there is no 'sense' for the pump - just the relay.
The relay gets ignition power on the coil + and enabled by the 'low' return at the ECM; when there is no 'low' it will sense the 12V (from ignition) through the relay coil, or post an error if not there; note that it would post the error if you had the relay removed while troubleshooting with ignition on; once posted it will remain there.
So install relay, clear codes and see if/what returns.
If error returns, check the ignition power to the relay coil+ terminal and of course the relay itself.

Quote:

triumph uses european relays, 2 of the pins are reversed in respect to american relays. you can pull out the spade connectors and switch them to convert to american relays or you can buy HELLA relays.

I would not recommend this - yes, it will 'work' - however the OEM-spec relays are configured with dual-suppression devices to protect the ECM from turn-off spikes; there is a diode in series to the low side of the coil and resistor across the coil itself.
In this case, I would advise go OEM.

One reasonably common problem where appears pump is not running, is that the hose to/from filter ruptures or blows off - this happens if the pump is dead-headed into the sealed connector (remember the regulator is after the return); it may also have happened if your hose clamps were not tight enough when you replaced the pump - but only way to check really, is to pull the pump.

And speaking further of 'earth' (ground)

Does your Sprint have a ground block?
That '99 is unique single-year-model Sprint, which shares the same ECM as the T509 (Speed Triple) and T595 (Daytona), both of which utilize this scheme:
Not sure if your bike shares that architecture ........
Looks like this, where all the ground returns come back into a single connector block
(and the burn is a common failure mode)

spendo · 11-10-2012, 06:05 PM

sorry for the delay in responding, i'm finally back on line, my hardrive crashed and i had to send this laptop off for repairs and reboot everything, but back now. the sprint has sat unattended for a few weeks due to some immediate work being req'd on the tiger and supermoto. but back to it now.
thanks so much for your thoughtful and insightful comments and recommendations. i'm learning something from every exchange. and sincerely appreciate your time and knowledge.
for the sprint, i cleared the error codes, and they did not come back, (only fuel level sensor, but the tube thing seems to screwed up). but the bike still would not start.
i'll pull the fuel pump out of the tank and see what is going on in there.
the sprint does not have a white connector as show in your photo. i pulled the fuse block to check for problems, all looks good, wiring goes directly into the harness. battery ground is a heavy cable bolting to frame, i have not yet found a central ground point for the wiring harness, the schematic does not seem to indicate a central ground point for the harness, but i'll look more closely.
thanks for the explanation of the relay protection. i see that each relay has a little schematic showing a diode and what must be the resistor. so thats what they are for....
makes sense, i'll undo the change on the 2 relays that i switched around.
next step will be to pull the pump, will report back.
thanks and thanks again for all your attention.
TS