Triumphrat

garry · 07-28-2005

Lots of speculation over on T595 about the sport lineup future too. Personally, I think the new 675cc triple (all the test bikes in the UK are registered as 675cc) will be the ONLY sportbike in Triumphs lineup. The D600/650 is dead and I expect the 955 'tona will follow shortly. Look for big incentives to move old stock if it survives into 2006. I don't think we're going to see a 1050 based 'tona as it would require a lot of new engineering on the top end to get power competitive and they'd still lose all the liter class sportbike shootouts, so why bother. The 750 sportbike niche is fairly open (Duc 749 is expensive and GSXR750 is way too common). I wish the 675 really was a 750/800, but the evidence from the UK indicates otherwise.

I guess we'll all know what's up in six weeks or so...

keystonejenks · 07-28-2005

I love what Triumph does. They sell real world sport bikes. They're comfy and you don't have to rev them high like a majority of the Japanese bikes.

I think they don't sell as well because they're not the "New Hottness." Plus, you can find a HondaSukiYamaKawa dealer every 30 miles.

IMHO, if Triumph would just increase their aftermarket visibility it would help greatly. Every try finding something as simple as signal quick disconnects for a Triumph? Oh, the pain.

Diego · 07-28-2005

> I maybe wrong but I would imagine the 'new' crankcase might be for the extra cc and the forces related to that. The under punched bikes are that way because of Triumphs modular manufacturing philosophies... (etc)

I think you're exactly right. Though modularity is no longer a cornerstone of their overall design philosophy, it remains a practical reality so far as engines are concerned. The new case design, head, etc. are a convenient way to let them build a larger engine for models where it is advantageous to do so, while allowing them to retain the established 955 for other models where there may be good reasons for holding displacement to a liter or less. That way, the 955 also gets to take advantage of the improvements that were needed for the 1050, and they can produce either engine at will without major re-tooling. It's a convenient evolutionary step.

Garry comments: "I don't think we're going to see a 1050 based 'tona as it would require a lot of new engineering on the top end to get power competitive and they'd still lose all the liter class sportbike shootouts, so why bother." I don't know that it would require all that much engineering, really, as the new evolved 955 is already in some or all of the 2005 Daytonas, but the "why bother" factor might play into it. The big Daytona has long been thought of as the "gentleman's sport bike" more than a hardcore racing competitor. That's not necessarily a bad thing in my book, but if Triumph doesn't want to put the effort into keeping it in the public eye (as keystonejenks notes) then naturally its sales will taper off as the "hot" models get all the attention.

We'll just have to see what that means for the future.

garry · 07-28-2005

Quote:

Garry comments: "I don't think we're going to see a 1050 based 'tona as it would require a lot of new engineering on the top end to get power competitive and they'd still lose all the liter class sportbike shootouts, so why bother."

John replied: I don't know that it would require all that much engineering, really, as the new evolved 955 is already in some or all of the 2005 Daytonas, but the "why bother" factor might play into it. The big Daytona has long been thought of as the "gentleman's sport bike" more than a hardcore racing competitor. That's not necessarily a bad thing in my book, but if Triumph doesn't want to put the effort into keeping it in the public eye (as keystonejenks notes) then naturally its sales will taper off as the "hot" models get all the attention.

To clarify my comment, I figure a new big Daytona would need to put an honest 150 HP down at the rear wheel and lose quite a bit of weight to even be competitive with the Jap 1000 sportsbikes. The Daytona has a different top-end from the Sprint and Speed Triple (pre-2005) which is where the extra power came from. AFAIK, that top end (cyls on up) isn't used in any other bike. How are they going to get an extra 20 HP out of that?

Then there's the whole racing issue in that market niche (win on Sunday, sell on Monday), the two year model turn-around cycle, and the massive advertising dollars the Japs have to buy mindshare. I don't think it's wise for Triumph to try to play in that space. It's just too bloody expensive and competitive.

Now if you figure your target market is the Suzuki SV1000S and
Honda Super Hawk buyer, they could be distinctive and competitive, but that niche doesn't seem to be selling well. Perhaps a 1050cc "Sprint Sport" with fully-adjustable suspension (from the Speed Triple) and sportier ergos could be marketed as a "special edition" Sprint for people with more sporting desires.

I'm just speculating (bored at work). I can't wait for official news from all the mfgrs on the 2006 models. It's like being a kid waiting for Christmas.

[ This message was edited by: garry on 2005-07-28 11:04 ]