Triumphrat

Disco88 · 11-11-2009, 04:25 PM

Hi

Finally My father and I bought a 1964 (?) Triumph .
And its great looking. I'll add a picture next time.

To me it looks like a 1963 T6 Thunderbird Bird but it's hard to tell.
The headlight is covered and the left side engine cover looks the same as a later model 650.

It has normal wings, but I got a 'bathtub' that was passed along between last owners with it.

The liecence says it's model 5TA. I'm not sure the registration is correct. It has a single AMAL carburator.

The VIN on both engine and chassis is TKA39696 and it has the marking of what looks like a police star ( in Israel ) on the engine next to the VIN.

Can any of you help me find out what model it is?

What is 'TKA' ?

Thrilled it's finally here.

Ofir , Israel

propforward · 11-11-2009, 04:29 PM

Hi Disco88, I'm going to move your post to the classics forum where there are some very knowledgable folks on those bikes.

Webby · 11-11-2009, 08:25 PM

Hi disco 88,
Welcome to the forum

I pic of you bike would help but I'll try my best with the info you have given.

I think your bike is pre 69, however I have no record of the number TKA in any of my books. The only thing I have is that 5T is for the speed twin model but the rest I have no idea. Maybe an ex police or military bike? (like the TR6P in the UK?)

Sorry I can't be of more help

Webby

Snakeoil · 11-11-2009, 10:37 PM

Welcome to the forum, Ofir.

I'm no expert, but I have a pretty good book on the subject. I just looked thru the section on engine and frame numbers and there is nothing in 1964 that lines up even close to the numerical part of your engine/frame numbers.

If it is a 5TA, the numbers are closer. The range for your numbers puts it in 1965. But it should have an H prefix, not the TKA that you mention.

As for the TKA, that prefix does not appear anywhere that I can find. Are you sure it's not TR something?

But even TR would not be right for your year. 1964 650s had a DU prefix followed by either 4 or 5 numbers. The range for 1964 650 and pre-unit 500 was DU5825-DU13374.

Neither the 5TA nor the 6T had a bathtub in 1964. Both had a skirt. The 5TA would have been 6V and the 6T 12V electrics.

What you describe as a police star for Israel... is that the Star of David? If so, then I'm going to guess here that the numbers on your bike were put on by Israel and not Triumph.
Hope this helps.
Rob

Disco88 · 11-12-2009, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakeoil

I'm no expert, but I have a pretty good book on the subject. I just looked thru the section on engine and frame numbers and there is nothing in 1964 that lines up even close to the numerical part of your engine/frame numbers.

If it is a 5TA, the numbers are closer. The range for your numbers puts it in 1965. But it should have an H prefix, not the TKA that you mention.

As for the TKA, that prefix does not appear anywhere that I can find. Are you sure it's not TR something?

...
Neither the 5TA nor the 6T had a bathtub in 1964. Both had a skirt. The 5TA would have been 6V and the 6T 12V electrics.

What you describe as a police star for Israel... is that the Star of David? If so, then I'm going to guess here that the numbers on your bike were put on by Israel and not Triumph.
Hope this helps.
Rob

Thank you Rob for checking.

We really liked the bike so we bought it. Now we are trying to see what it is - How else can I order parts for it?

I would like to add some details:

1. The 'Star' is defenently Israeli Police emblem stamped right next to the Engine VIN. '2' is also stamped below it.
2. 'TKA39696' is clearly marked at the engine - no mistake here.
3. The bathtub ( could be a 'skirt' ) was handed over with the bike. Could be from another one - no one knows.
4. It was partly restored at one point - I can't say how.
5. It is 12v and the left engine cover is of later 'winged' type. Not clear like some TR I've seen.
6. The Headlamp is covered.

How can I tell the engine volume? Type of bike ?

Pictures added here -

Thank you again, Great to have my childhood dream bike back.

Ofir , Israel

P.s. It has a fresh MOT and it is a runner.

GrandPaulZ · 11-12-2009, 11:13 AM

It is an early unit construction 650. Could be anywhere between 63 - 67.

The serial number is very puzzling; probable re-stamp.

T120, TR6 or 6T FOR SURE; 650cc.

Webby · 11-12-2009, 11:24 AM

Hi Disco 88,

It looks like a 64!
Here's how you can tell:
Unit construction (engine & gearbox as one assembly) This started in 63.
The front forks are fitted with external springs, these were fitted from the start of 64.
Front Brake, the small diameter single leading shoe was fitted up to the end of 65 (I think)
Tail light: The tail light with the integral lifting handle was fitted up to the end of 65.
They stopped fitting the parcel grid in 66 (for the US) but continued up till 68 for the UK models.
Your tank badges are pre 65.
As for the nacelle, I have no idea

You're right about the primary cover, it is from a 68 or later bike, it's a good modification, makes it easier to time the bike

I hope this helps

Webby

GrandPaulZ · 11-12-2009, 11:28 AM

I'm not going to try to narrow down the year, as it's obvious that the nacelle is out of place. The front wheel could be off an earlier model, and the tank could as well. Or, the engine could be a later unit engine in an earlier frame, etc.

Much of the bike looks earlier than the engine, and the shorter US style mufflers look out of place as well.

The main thing is that it's a 650 unit engine, 90% of the parts (or more) are interchangeable from year to year from 63 to 69, and probably more than 50% are interchangeable up through mid 70s.

What I would do is clean & service it thoroughly, get it running, and ride it just as it is for a while. I'll bet it would run forever with a bit of love.

DAVE M · 11-12-2009, 12:29 PM

try contacting the TOMCC here in the UK.

They have the factory records and can often help with weird one-offs

http://www.tomcc.org/Dating.aspx

I'd suggest a lot of decent photos and close-ups of the numbers etc.

The nacelle has been chopped to fit so it's probably not correct for the forks (or the bars)

The whole bike looks like an attempt at a Triumph Saint to me

http://imcdb.org/images/111/893.jpg

Snakeoil · 11-12-2009, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrandPaulZ

I'm not going to try to narrow down the year, as it's obvious that the nacelle is out of place. The front wheel could be off an earlier model, and the tank could as well. Or, the engine could be a later unit engine in an earlier frame, etc.

Much of the bike looks earlier than the engine, and the shorter US style mufflers look out of place as well.

Somewhere in Israel, is a guy dressed in black, with a picture of an old white Triumph on the wall, strummin' a guitar and singin'...

"I got it one piece at a time, and it didn't cost me a dime...."

Rob