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Old 11-27-2012, 03:44 PM   #51 (permalink)
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This is the sort of talk the ultra-lefties hate.
This ultra-lefty doesn't mind it at all.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:47 PM   #52 (permalink)
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It's Darwinism at it's best if they choose to be defenseless.
So if I don't own a gun and someone breaks into my house and attacks me it's MY fault??


Lame.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:25 PM   #53 (permalink)
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So if I don't own a gun and someone breaks into my house and attacks me it's MY fault??

Lame.
You must share culpability in the same fashion as a man who falls off his bike with no gear, or the man who doesn't keep at least one fire extinguisher in his shop/kitchen to keep small accidental fires from spreading, or the man that contracts a 'social disease' because he refused to wear a condom and engaged in risky sex practices, or the man who fails to keep his valuables secure to prevent theft or even the temptation of theft to others, or the man that injures himself with his latest power tool because he failed to read the manual, or whatever abdication of responsibility one can think of. This is the problem with society today, we rely on others to do things for us that we should at least make an attempt to do for ourselves; it's easier to blame others instead. An ADULT does what is necessary within the laws of his locality to safeguard from harm himself and all the dependants he is responsible for. The blame most often lies with the one weakest enough to lay it.

Keep this firmly in mind; when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. The "lame" comment is uncalled for and does nothing to further an otherwise friendly discussion. .........James.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:31 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Criminal court is the least of this shooters worries. The civil case will be the end all.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:33 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Whatever.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:34 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Thruxton-Texas View Post
You must share culpability in the same fashion as a man who falls off his bike with no gear, or the man who doesn't keep at least one fire extinguisher in his shop/kitchen to keep small accidental fires from spreading, or the man that contracts a 'social disease' because he refused to wear a condom and engaged in risky sex practices, or the man who fails to keep his valuables secure to prevent theft or even the temptation of theft to others, or the man that injures himself with his latest power tool because he failed to read the manual, or whatever abdication of responsibility one can think of. This is the problem with society today, we rely on others to do things for us that we should at least make an attempt to do for ourselves; it's easier to blame others instead. An ADULT does what is necessary within the laws of his locality to safeguard from harm himself and all the dependants he is responsible for. The blame most often lies with the one weakest enough to lay it.

Keep this firmly in mind; when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. The "lame" comment is uncalled for and does nothing to further an otherwise friendly discussion. .........James.
I don't exactly know what to think about that. There's a lot more harm from gun ownership that comes from accident and mis-use (by the owner, or someone in the household) than from purposeful and intentional use on an invader. It doesn't seem very responsible of me to put myself at a higher statistical risk from a fatal accident than I would be from a fatal crime.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:37 PM   #57 (permalink)
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This whole situation is a giant bag of fail.

burglary: fail
murder: fail

None of the parties were in the right here. Sure, you have a right to defend yourself even if that means you have to kill someone else to do it. That does not mean you have the right to go on the offense. I don't have a problem with this knobgobbler shooting the burglars; I have a problem with him not stopping. What a psychopath...

I don't really see this as a gun problem, the guns were just the tool he used to murder them. He would have killed those kids with whatever he had on hand. I am explicitly not going to get into some argument over the relative effectiveness of killing tools.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:44 PM   #58 (permalink)
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This is obviously not something that happens to everyone every day in the U.S., but it does appear to be something that people invest a lot of psychic energy preparing themselves for (a home invader who I have to shoot dead before they kill me)? It must suck to live in that much fear.

I've noted a lot of talk on this thread about "rights and laws" and from the defenders of these absolutes, not much mention of any scale of morality... like for example, that taking a life when it is not absolutely necessary might be a little worse than somebody taking your TV. If it truly is a last resort and what a reasonable man would do, I'm okay with it. Let's call this what it is: a cold blooded vigilante with an itchy trigger finger.

Last edited by steve betts; 11-27-2012 at 04:49 PM.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:46 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thruxton-Texas View Post
You must share culpability in the same fashion as a man who falls off his bike with no gear, or the man who doesn't keep at least one fire extinguisher in his shop/kitchen to keep small accidental fires from spreading, or the man that contracts a 'social disease' because he refused to wear a condom and engaged in risky sex practices, or the man who fails to keep his valuables secure to prevent theft or even the temptation of theft to others, or the man that injures himself with his latest power tool because he failed to read the manual, or whatever abdication of responsibility one can think of. This is the problem with society today, we rely on others to do things for us that we should at least make an attempt to do for ourselves; it's easier to blame others instead. An ADULT does what is necessary within the laws of his locality to safeguard from harm himself and all the dependants he is responsible for. The blame most often lies with the one weakest enough to lay it.

Keep this firmly in mind; when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. The "lame" comment is uncalled for and does nothing to further an otherwise friendly discussion. .........James.
The problem with your examples is that none of them involve safety gear that results in harm to others in order to safeguard the user so their use doesn't have much in the way of a moral dimension.

That said, it's perfectly possible to own and still make the choice not to use a gun.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:48 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thruxton-Texas View Post
You must share culpability in the same fashion as a man who falls off his bike with no gear, or the man who doesn't keep at least one fire extinguisher in his shop/kitchen to keep small accidental fires from spreading, or the man that contracts a 'social disease' because he refused to wear a condom and engaged in risky sex practices, or the man who fails to keep his valuables secure to prevent theft or even the temptation of theft to others, or the man that injures himself with his latest power tool because he failed to read the manual, or whatever abdication of responsibility one can think of. This is the problem with society today, we rely on others to do things for us that we should at least make an attempt to do for ourselves; it's easier to blame others instead. An ADULT does what is necessary within the laws of his locality to safeguard from harm himself and all the dependants he is responsible for. The blame most often lies with the one weakest enough to lay it.

Keep this firmly in mind; when seconds count, the police are only minutes away. .........James.
I agree.
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