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Old 11-11-2012, 12:44 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Excellent...no parole...no access to press...no ability to write or publish stories..create an abyss denying any contact period..
That would be critical I think. Not just a 'life' sentence that somehow later actually gets parole. Our latest attempt to change specifically said 'life without parole' and I think other than some extremely vindictive types most would probably be good with that except for the fear that somehow be let loose 20, 30, however many years later. Or that they'll live in relative 'luxury' while in prison.

No, for these crimes I would be more than happy to see death row converted to solitary where the convicted basically spends 23 hours a day in his cell with no outside contact. Let 'em out an hour a day to take a shower and walk the yard for exercise. And when we say 'no parole', it has to mean No Parole.

For Christ's sake, Manson still gets parole hearings. Sure, they'll never let him out (I think...) but they still go through the process, therefore giving him that slim sliver of hope. These guys need to know they're done - that that cell is the last thing they're ever going to see; that they'll breath their last right there in that 8x10 cinder block hole. (or whatever size they are...8x10 seems plenty big under this circumstance)
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Old 11-11-2012, 01:36 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Have a look at the Black Dolphin " correctional " facility in Russia .
This is where he belongs if he is allowed to live.
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Old 11-11-2012, 02:32 PM   #93 (permalink)
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He should be forced to read and memorize all of the "what oil is best" threads on Triumphrat.net. That would fix the SOB.
You sick bastard. That's inhumane. Nobody, NOBODY deserves that.
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:10 PM   #94 (permalink)
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That would be critical I think. Not just a 'life' sentence that somehow later actually gets parole. Our latest attempt to change specifically said 'life without parole' and I think other than some extremely vindictive types most would probably be good with that except for the fear that somehow be let loose 20, 30, however many years later. Or that they'll live in relative 'luxury' while in prison.

No, for these crimes I would be more than happy to see death row converted to solitary where the convicted basically spends 23 hours a day in his cell with no outside contact. Let 'em out an hour a day to take a shower and walk the yard for exercise. And when we say 'no parole', it has to mean No Parole.

For Christ's sake, Manson still gets parole hearings. Sure, they'll never let him out (I think...) but they still go through the process, therefore giving him that slim sliver of hope. These guys need to know they're done - that that cell is the last thing they're ever going to see; that they'll breath their last right there in that 8x10 cinder block hole. (or whatever size they are...8x10 seems plenty big under this circumstance)
If you Google "luxury prison" the first hit takes you to Norway's Halden prison. I say, BFD. I don't care how well off the prisoner's life is. I don't care what they think, how comfortable they are, or even if they are deprived in any way except for their freedom and access to the media. Just let them sit there and exist, till they croak, where they won't bother anyone anymore and won't incite their political or hateful agenda.

It doesn't give me any satisfaction or make me any safer if people suffer. Bottom line, there's is nothing I would ever trade from my freedom and public voice. A life without freedom would surely be a sorry lot.


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You sick bastard. That's inhumane. Nobody, NOBODY deserves that.
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:14 PM   #95 (permalink)
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Recidivism (re-offending) rates in Norway is around 20%, while in the US it's around 65%, and in the UK it's 50%. So say what you will about their soft justice, it works better than either of ours.

Not saying I want Breivik out in 21 years, but for the most part it seems Norway does justice better than we do in the UK, or they do in the States....
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Old 11-11-2012, 03:22 PM   #96 (permalink)
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It is a pity they cannot transfer Anders Behring Breivik to a correctional facility here in South Africa. They are prisons to be feared...







Brutal South African jail changes ex-convict's life: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...nt/9139624.stm

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Old 11-11-2012, 04:19 PM   #97 (permalink)
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Can we elaborate on suffer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBALEE View Post
..create an abyss denying any contact period..
Yes. I think an abyss of isolation pretty much covers it. Short of torturing the demented prick, I'd say isolation is about as much sufferance you could dish up.

Normally, I argue with qualifiers like "IMO" or "this is my opinion I am not trying to get you to change yours". In this case I'd like to change your opinion, I'd like everyone to be opposed to killing; but I am not banking on it. I'd like you to know that I am not posting try and stir you up either, I hope I am not insulting you with my opinions.

What if, just a suggestion, but what if all the increases in social pressure and turmoil from poorer quality nutrition to poorly understood medication to increased levels of environmental toxins or even the sub-wooffing coming from wind farms - what if they are, in combination, bending and distorting peoples' heads and producing nutjobs? A sort of environmental lobotomy, wouldn't you want to know about it or at least try to find out?

Another what if. In other forms of life, say bees f'rinstance, if you take away a bee that plays a particular role - even the queen - another bee morphs into that role. What if, our society has x-number of psychopaths and every time you destroy one it causes an ordinary person to become a psycho by some weird natural law we have not nutted out yet?

My arguments are not great or very convincing I know, but I am trying to make the point that attempting to eradicate something is never as easy as we think it is and we usually make a pig's breakfast while doing it. The only NASTY, UNWANTED natural phenomenon that I know we've managed to eradicate is small pox. Please remind me if I missed any.
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Old 11-11-2012, 04:46 PM   #98 (permalink)
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I don't see how punishment cures mental illness or derangement. Without question, as a society we need to protect ourselves from people who are dangerous but I don't sit comfortably when people call for such people to be made to suffer or be punished.

Like you I think trying to understand why people are the way they are is important in the same way as understanding plague and polio has made the world a better place. Doesn't mean I think plague or polio are things I am 'soft' on. Hasn't made it go away but we have made its impact much smaller.
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:17 PM   #99 (permalink)
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I am in no way intending to suggest that punishment is a cure.

I am trying to suggest that such individuals are the essence of mental derangement and therefore worthy of study - humane study.

On eradication, or lessening of signs and symptoms; I think antibiotics and their uses are an excellent model for my point. We have now lived under the belief that antibiotics are a panacea for all infections for so long that we are near the end of them being at all effective. 4-Corners (for Jonk and other Aussies - http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stori...25/3618608.htm), only a week or two ago, suggested that within a decade we could be back to a situation similar (or worse) to how things were pre-antibiotics due to the amateur attitude we have that we "special clever" people can eradicate everything we take exception to; like our Norwegian mate and his ilk.
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Last edited by Boldor; 11-11-2012 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 11-11-2012, 06:21 PM   #100 (permalink)
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I am in no way intending to suggest that punishment is a cure.
sorry I wasn't meaning to imply you did.
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