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Old 11-25-2012, 02:30 PM   #121 (permalink)
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Ride and do what is best for your own style and not that of others.

Nuff Said.
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Old 11-25-2012, 02:38 PM   #122 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by zelatore View Post
I'm going to hold onto some pathetic hope that the CHP will save us on this one. My understanding is the only reason we have legal lane splitting in CA is the CHP moto-officers were in favor of it.

Maybe, these are the same guys that are in favor of open faced helmets
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:34 PM   #123 (permalink)
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I keep both feet on the pegs at lights. That way I am ready for anything.


Obviously my techniques were flawed. For some reason I had never tried this until I read of your technique Jonk - now I do it always - Love It! Ta Jonk.
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Old 11-25-2012, 03:44 PM   #124 (permalink)
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quote: "Two issues here - on the staying in gear, the book says no, because if you get rear ended the jerk will probably cause you to release the clutch and twist the throttle open. That's a good way to die."

That's possible, but not likely. More likely you will pop the clutch and kill the engine because your release will be too fast and jerky. Most of us probably do it differently at different stops, depending on circumstances. The various opinions suggest that there is no one right answer. Left foot down? Clutch in, first gear at the ready? Neutral? Both feet down? I've done them all and don't really care.
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:40 PM   #125 (permalink)
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Obviously my techniques were flawed. For some reason I had never tried this until I read of your technique Jonk - now I do it always - Love It! Ta Jonk.
You and Jonk have it all wrong. I shut my bike down at red lights and get off it. It's the only safe way.
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:47 PM   #126 (permalink)
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You and Jonk have it all wrong. I shut my bike down at red lights and get off it. It's the only safe way.
No way guys. You are supposed to wear those retro shoes with the built in wheels that pop out the bottom while you are riding so at stop signs you can put the bike in first gear and then put both feet down so you can do what we here in California call the "California Rolling Stop".



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Old 11-26-2012, 03:50 AM   #127 (permalink)
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I've been using the 'System' and riding by 'Motorcycle Roadcraft' since 1978 when the Cheshire Police trained me as a civilian instructor. Note the book's title. Roadcraft. Not Trackcraft or Dirtcraft. Roadcraft.

The thing about being in gear or neutral or whatever when you're stopped with the right foot up just means changing feet to get the gear right for moving off then changing back before you do. Sounds awkward and it took me a few months to make it a complete habit, but like anything else,once you've done that it stops being an issue. Just a matter of putting in a bit of extra effort to make doing it right the natural thing to do.

There was a post last week on a Kawasaki forum - a guy had just been rear ended. He was in neutral with both brakes applied. Got away with minor damage, but reckoned that if he'd been in gear and without both brakes he'd have been pushed into the traffic stream. The stats show that it's safer to be in neutral if you're rear ended, but they don't have figures for the number of riders who avoid being rear ended because they're in gear. Until they do we're never going to know what's statistically safest, and even then you can still make a situational judgement.

Saphena - I've noticed a lot of UK police stopping with the right foot going down over the last few years. It's not the way they're taught. Should stop with right foot still on the peg until the bike has stopped moving then swap feet to put the right foot down. Like me, they're just being lazy.

I got caught out once on a scoot with linked brakes. Had to do an emergency stop in heavy rain when a dog ran out in front of the car I was following. At about 3 feet away and nearly stopped I wanted to release the front brake. Couldn't do that with linked brakes - I had a choice vetween keeping the brakes on and risking a front wheel lock up, or letting them go and rolling into the back of the car. I kept them on and the front wheel locked up. No damage to the scoot but I tore a strip of skin off my ankle that ruined a weekend away. Another lesson there. If you're only going 700 yards for petrol, put your bloody boots on.

Last time I tried keeping both feet on the pegs was turning into my drive just before my wife died. I was miles away. Half turned into the drive and with the bike motionless I just sat there, both feet on the pegs. After a few minutes it fell over. Odd thing is - if I'm really trying to do that I can only balance it for a few seconds lol.

Rob

Last edited by williamr; 11-26-2012 at 04:07 AM.
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:59 AM   #128 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by williamr View Post
I've been using the 'System' since 1978 when the Cheshire Poluce trained me as a civilian instructor.

The thing about being in gear or neutral or whatever when you're stopped with the right foot up just means changing feet to get the gear right for moving off then changing back before you do.
The 'Hendon Shuffle' I think it is called over there (after the Hendon police college).



I have read all this and have now decided the easiest solution is not to stop in the first place.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:45 AM   #129 (permalink)
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Saphena - I've noticed a lot of UK police stopping with the right foot going down over the last few years. It's not the way they're taught. Should stop with right foot still on the peg until the bike has stopped moving then swap feet to put the right foot down. Like me, they're just being lazy.
At a gathering of IAM/ROSPA examiners last year I discovered that it's even worse than that: some forces train one way and other forces train the other way.

Neither Motorcycle Roadcraft nor "How to be a better rider" stipulate left foot or right foot down although the latter does include, with respect to stopping on hills, "cover the rear brake" which would imply bike in gear, left foot down.

There is no absolute "this is always the right way to do it", circumstances vary, but the thing that was drummed into me was that consistency reduces stress and increases safety. My default approach to stopping is that I'm going to stop, right foot down then fiddle with the gears using my left foot which is still in position but what I'll actually do will depend on the exact circumstances of each stop.
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Old 11-26-2012, 07:25 AM   #130 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BrewDudeBob View Post
It should be habit for you to be in 1st gear whenever you stop with your clutch engaged...
When I do that on my bike the engine just stops.
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