Triumph Rat Motorcycle Forums banner

can-bus defeated!

11K views 12 replies 8 participants last post by  Baxster 
#1 ·
Sort of - ok, so that title might be a little click-baity, but if you've made it this far, you'll probably find what I have to say interesting nonetheless.

it's been a while since i've updated here, but I think I've made a breakthrough. First, a little background - last summer I picked up what wound up being a total basket case, a "2012" bonnie, in theory anyway - the bike wasn't running properly when I got it, but I managed, with the help of a few the wonderful people here, to get it running properly, checked the valves, etc. etc.

Once i finally got it on the road, I realized that the speedo wasn't working, and being a can-bus bike, it had the digital dash. "look for the speed sensor!" they said, but alas, I could not find it, nor was there an empty mounting point for it.

No speed sensor mount? on a can-bus bike? surely something's afoot. I checked everything I could figure - vin and ecu matched up, but I came to the conclusion that at some point, something happened - the bike was relatively clean, ran and rode just fine, but it did have evidence of a drop, some scraped up pipes, etc. I think someone let the bike down while it was running, and it was starved of oil, and when they replaced the engine, they didn't account for the difference between the can-bus and older efi engines. there was a vacuum leak when I got it, so it may have never even occurred to whomever it was that did the work that there were incompatibilities, but alas, I suppose that's giving them the benefit of the doubt.

anyway, I rode the bike for a couple of months, did some work and customized it to my liking. I removed the worthless speedo and tucked it in the headlight temporarily while decided what I wanted to do - I didn't really want to shell out 400 bucks for the motogadget solution, but nothing else really seemed an option, then I started doing a little bit of digging and realized a couple of things. The first thing I realized was that the ecu for all efi bikes is the same part number, so I did a little more research there, then I stumbled upon a thread where someone used an engine from a can-bus bike on an older EFI bike - ecu and wiring harness were compatible you say? that got me thinking harder - I tried to flash an older map to my ecu, but it wouldn't take with Tune-ECU, so I scoured ebay for a reasonable priced ecu from an older, non-can bus EFI bike, found one with a 14 day return policy, and ordered that bad boy up. It got here today, so I pulled it out of the box, disconnected the battery and the can-bus speedo circuit board that was tucked in the headlight bucket, and swapped the ecus. Turned the ignition on and I heard the glorious whine of the fuel pump, which wouldn't happen with the speedo disconnected on a can-bus ecu. So i said "**** it", and hit the starter. Bike started right up, and idled just fine. I can't ride it right now since it's cold and raining here in NJ, but I'll connect it to the laptop tomorrow, check and probably update the map, and check for error codes since I don't have a check engine light at the moment - then maybe I'll take it for a ride.

So, now I guess I have a couple of questions - first - is this a generally terrible idea and I'm overlooking something ridiculously obvious, putting me at risk of losing life or limb if I carry on?

second, does anyone know of anything off the top of their head I should look for running this motor/ecu, and what map would be best to use? I'm not exactly sure what year the motor is from, but as I said before, it doesn't have a speedo sensor mount, so I know it's older than 2011ish?

third, is there any way to bypass the error I got saying the can-bus ECU in tuneecu and flash it with firmware similar to what's on the older ECU? I didn't try very hard, since tuneecu shut me down pretty quick when I tried to flash the map I downloaded from their website - I believe it was the stock map from a 2008 ecu, and the ECU I got with the bike is from a 2012 model. Like I mentioned earlier - I believe the hardware is the same, based on what I saw on the hermey's site and the fact that the two I have look to be identical, at least on the outside. I would prefer, if everything else checks out, to keep the ecu I have while eliminating the issues caused by my configuration, but if I wind up having to keep the older one, i'll deal with that, since it opens up many options such as having a speedometer that works, and not having to worry about the stupid circuit board floating around in the headlight bucket leaving me stranded when it decides it doesn't want to talk to the ecu for whatever reason.

Hopefully this will wind up helping out other members with can-bus bikes who want to tinker, but don't want to shell out the 8-900 bucks those motogadget units cost just to replace the ugly gauges the bikes come with stock.

I'm also aware that there was a member here recently testing out an alternative to the motogadget adapter, but if we could eliminate the need for an adapter all together, I think that would be great, especially if it winds up being something that can be done relatively cheap.
 
See less See more
#4 ·
Hi. Interesting post. I presume the unit you settled on was the pre canbus one?. I know that the programmes/tunes are different for canbus/non-canbus. Interesting how it functions with the later loom. Did you try and take off power for the clock lights/warning lights?.

Rob
 
#8 ·
I did see the YBox, and there's the MTri unit as well, but for me that would have only taken care of part of my issue - It would be smaller than the circuitboard from the digital dash I had tucked into the headlight bucket, but i dont have a speed sensor mount on my engine case, so the ECU would still be sending 0mph to the speedo with that device.

I decided to roll the dice on the ECU in hopes of eliminating as much extra hardware from the canbus that wasn't useful as I could - with this i dont have to hide or mount anything extra and I should be able to use the harness to for things like idiot lights and power, and set up an analog speedo sensor for the motogadget unit I plan to eventually mount up - plus it was less than the cost of the mtri or the y box.
 
#7 ·
Sorry for the delayed response - a lot has changed since the last time I logged in here - new house and a new job in a new town, and all that goes along with that!

So, since I swapped out the ecu on my bonnie, I've literally done nothing to it except check the tire pressure and ride the thing. I haven't had any issues to speak of with it - it starts, runs, and rides exactly as you would expect. all of the switches function as you would expect as well. that said, I still haven't gotten around to mounting any gauges on it, so I don't know if the harness will function as I expect it to in that regard, but I'm fairly confident it will based on what I've researched.

I was never able to successfully get the older tune loaded onto the newer ECU, although I suspect that this is a software issue more than one related to the hardware - as far as I remember, all of the EFI ecus are the same part number and anecdotally the two units I have look exactly the same, so I still think there's probably a way to get that old map onto a newer ECU, I just don't have the time or knowledge to figure out how to make it work. I suspect the guys who wrote the tuning software (the name is escaping me at the moment) would be able to do it, but there's somewhat of a language barrier there from what I can tell from communicating with them through email.

Hope this helps!
 
#12 ·
Hi Baxster, a forum member did come up and sold a solution however I quess due to a lack of interest have ceased supply and activity which is sad.

It would be nice if we may find another solution as the only option price and with conversion to Australian dollars is very very costly....
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top