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Stupid Triumph Tricks

5K views 43 replies 31 participants last post by  imokyourenot 
#1 ·
So I got a question that must be prefaced with a bit of a story.

I have decided that the ignition switch on my Bonneville is my arch-nemesis. For some reason, when I get off the bike, I get tunnel vision and never think to look back to see if my headlight is still on. I have lost count of how many times I have left the ignition on after stopping the bike. Luckily I have only killed the battery twice, the second time being today after work. I am an instructor for the military and work with soldiers everyday. Now imagine my fat butt waddling down the parking lot for all I'm worth, trying to get enough speed to pop the clutch and salvage what is left of my pride, while a whole formation of soldiers stood there, watching and snickering. My enemy has struck again.

After getting the bike to start, I put the bike in neutral and pulled out the choke in an attempt to get the engine revs up and prevent the bike from stalling. Here's where my question comes in. About a minute after pulling out the choke, the bike started to stutter or miss in a very strange way. It seemed to be a pattern with giving some gas making no difference except a louder stutter. I disengaged the choke and the strange sputtering stopped. Has anyone ever experience this or have any ideas what it might be? Thanks.
 
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#2 ·
I'm easily confused, so bare with me. Do you not kill the engine by turning off the ignition? Are you walking away from your bike with the key in the ignition with it switched on? Normally, the choke is applied before starting, as an aid with a cold engine. I let my bike idle with the choke full on for about a minute, then I take off. Once under way, I reach down and push the knob in (off) If it's warm enough to start without the choke, you don't need it. If your engine routinely stalls on you, the idle may be set too low. There is a black knob sticking out from under the left hand carb that adjusts the idle on both carbs simultaniously. Hope I helped . Dan
 
#3 ·
As an old soldier myself, I strongly recommend you charge yourself under Army Regulations 167-12 sub para 5 sub sub para IIV . As a soldier did not remove keys from ignition, and also bust yourself down one rank "Sar Major, march out the guilty party". :(
 
#4 ·
I feel for you ZigHawk...I've left my ignition on once and walked away. Luckily, I too was on a military installation where it is relativly safe. Nobody rode off on my bike and I haven't made the same mistake twice.

On the other hand...you're making us look bad :hammer: There were probably many bike riders in those formations you ran your bike past thinking...man, Triumphs must be *****! :(
 
#5 ·
In spite of what the MSF course teaches, I do not use the kill switch to stop the bike for several reasons. The reason in this post is the main one. I turn off the ignition to stop the bike and pull the key.
 
#7 ·
Two things: 1) The choke is actually just an extra, temporary fuel source called an 'enricher', intended to add excess gas to a cold engine condition. This 'shoves' extra gas into cold manifolds/cylinders' area to vaporize enough fuel to keep her running. As the engine warms, and natural vaporization begins to increase, this excess fuel starts to cause an overly rich condition and the engine starts to tell you this by increasingly rough running. Depending on ambient temperature, you ought to start pushing in the 'choke' after 20 to 45 seconds. Too much choke (ie, excessively rich) for too long can cause fuel 'wash-down' of oil on your cyl walls. Not good. 2) I too had this 'key left on' problem and solved it by installing a tiny piezo buzzer that sounds when the engine is stopped, but the key is still on. 3 years later and no problems since. See the Delphi New Bonneville forum, thread 1740.1 for install/hardware details. Bill
URL is: http://forums.delphiforums.com/New_Bonneville/messages/?start=Start+Reading+%3E%3E
 
#8 ·
"Why do I have a kill switch?"

LT,

To quote my owners handbook:

"The engine stop switch is for emergency use. If an emergency arises which requires the engine to be stopped, move the engine stop switch to the 'off' position. NOTE: Although the engine stop switch stops the engine, it does not turn off all the electrical circuits. Ordinarily, the ignition switch should be used to stop the engine."

The engine stop switch is positioned so it can be easily reached in an emergency situation--the key switch is not easily gotten to in an emergency.

If anyone is teaching that the emergency stop switch should be used to kill the engine on a ordinary basis, they are wrong for Triumph motorcycles. The key switch should be used to kill the engine on an ordinary basis. This is how Triumphs are designed and using the key switch prevents a lot of unnecessary problems that can and do arise from using the emergency engine stop switch.

Larry



[ This message was edited by: RedBird on 2005-12-14 20:42 ]
 
#9 ·
OK, lemme answer a few questions.

First, I use the kill switch because I leave the bike in gear when I shut down. You ever try to reach over the handlebars, with the clutch in, and then contort your arm to reach that massively inconveniently located ignition?

Second, I never ride with the choke engaged. The bike had been sitting in the wind and if it had died because of cold, the dead battery issue would have condemned me to another run of shame.

Third, everyone on Ft. Huachuca loves my bike (except for all the wannabes that saw Biker Boys and are trying to kill themselves). I can't go anywhere without compliments, and have probably sold about three Triumphs just by ridin around.

Bill, thanks for the info. Learn something new every day.
 
#14 ·
> Larry, you clever devil. Who would have thought to look in the Owner's Handbook??? I guess I'm changing my stopping habits.

:roflmoa2: Good man. That'll be better all around. It is a bit of contortion to do what you were describing earlier. Much better to plan your parking where it's safe to have at least one hand off the grips to use the key.

Just to expound a bit on what bhart1239 said about the choke, remember that it has a range of action. It's not all-or-nothing. All the way out may only be needed on a really cold day, part way for a milder day. One can eventually learn to judge how much is needed, and engaging it before cranking is the way to ensure more reliable starting...not just smooth idling after it fires.

And as the engine warms up, progressively less richness is needed for smooth running. In fact, when the engine is nearing full operating temperature, the choke being most or all of the way out can actually provide far too rich a fuel/air mixture for stable combustion. That's why it ran rougher after a while, and using the throttle only made it stutter even more.

Finally, a thought to head off another type of embarassment in the near future: after a lead-acid battery has been drained dead a few times, enough irreversible sulfation accumulates on the plates to where it can no longer deliver sufficient cranking current...especially on a chilly day. It thus fails earlier than if it were always kept normally charged. So, I would recommend planning on a new battery soon. The old one may not fail immediately, but it is now living on borrowed time.
 
#15 ·
Redbird wrote: "This is how Triumphs are designed and using the key switch prevents a lot of unnecessary problems that can and do arise from using the emergency engine stop switch".
Please list the "lots" of problems that arise from using the handlebar switch to kill the engine. Using this switch is how the MSA safety course tells students to kill the engine EVERY time. They say this in order to get riders used to using this rapid ignition kill method, should an emergency arise. It can save valuable seconds of not having to think about where to kill the engine at panic time (sudden fuel leak, stuck throttle, etc). The key switch is (and should be) relegated to a security function. The handlebar switch is the REAL off/on control. Bill H
 
#16 ·
It can save valuable seconds of not having to think about where to kill the engine at panic time (sudden fuel leak, stuck throttle, etc). The key switch is (and should be) relegated to a security function. The handlebar switch is the REAL off/on control. Bill H
When riding a bike you should be so tuned into what’s going on you should not have to think. It should all be as natural as walking.

This is one thing that I could never understand when someone asks you how you do this on a bike or how do you do that. I cannot tell you I just do it. Ask me now what side is my gear lever on I don’t know it’s just there. This was the same for me when riding my old bonnie and going straight over to a Jap bike with the control switched. I did not have to think about the switch they were just there and I can never ever remember hitting the incorrect lever.
 
#17 ·
Zighawk,

If you want to leave the bike in gear when you park it, you do not have to have the engine running to do this. After you turn off the ignition, simply pull in the clutch and kick it down into first.

I rarely do this with the TBA but occasionally do it with the Rocket if there is any question in my mind that the ground is not at least a little back tilted. The R3 ha a LOT more weight in front of the kickstand and can roll forward and drop the bike!

Cogito ergo equito

Bob
 
#18 ·
All this talk of 'kill switch' and 'ignition switch' baffles me.

I thought the proper way to stop thye engine was to hold the rear brake on and dump the clutch.

Alternatively, one could just wait, the tank only holds a few hours worth of fuel at idle.

Failing either of the above methods, draining all the oil will stop the engine in just a few minutes.

:wink:

Pete.
 
#19 ·
Why don't you just get in the habit of actually killing the bike by turning the key (ignition) off and pulling the key out at the same time. It sounds like you shut off the engine with the kill switch and walk away. I always kill the engine by turning off the ignition. I never use the kill switch just for that reason.
 
#20 ·
now now Pete.

I must admit I am a little confused, I have never used the kill switch as a regular means to switch off the engine on any bike I've ever owned. The kill switch is intended for emergency situations such as when you slide down the road, should the engine be still running and you alive, then hit the kill switch to prevent further mayhem.

To some extent it's a bit unnecessary, I know we were all a little puzzled when we first saw them on Jap bikes here in the UK. We just use the ignition key so why the need??

The T100 ignition key does seem to be in an odd place, but it is a small touch that mimics the original bike. I just don't have any probs leaning forward and reaching down to use it. Mind you I'm 11st (154lb) and fairly slim so don't have a big fat belly to hinder me (refer to the F.A.R.T club elsewhere on this site).

I suppose it's a bit like pressing the launch button on an inter-continental missile simply to clear the silo so you can get in to clean it out!?


:wink:
 
#21 ·
Must admit I've never used the kill switch either. As Dave_bee says we were all confused when they appeared on jap bikes let alone Triumph. Probably some obscure European or US safety law started it all off.

I usually put the stand down, get off the bike, turn off the ignition and take the keys out. Remembering to actually lock it is another matter!

I think my aversion to using the kill switch is that on a lot of jap bikes I've had starting problems can often be traced to kill switch faults so the advice was leave it on and leave it alone!

Steve
 
#22 ·
I liken a motorcycle's "kill switch" to a "dead man's switch"...... I use it in the event of the sudden/unannounced need to 'kill' the engine. This is usually when the bike is starting to list outa my control, falling, and I've got it in gear, clutch lever pulled in....... I 'kill' the engine with the switch before the the handlebar/clutch lever is yanked out my hand upon falling toward the ground. Otherwise, I normally turn my ignition off by reaching (awkward though it may be) for the key.

In addition, ever since the old days (prior to the addition of kickstand switches), it's become a habit of mine to park the bike in neutral. I can't say that there has EVER been an occasion when I have regretted not putting my bike in gear while parked. I can understand the reasoning, but HEY, it's just some'n I don't find the need to do.

With regard to the choke......
It's not unusual for me to ride in the sub 40's. My habit is to get fully dressed, pull the choke out, fire up the engine, manipulate the throttle until the engine idles on it's own, then climb onto the bike. I sit on the bike, tug at my gloves & jacket, adjust my helmet, rev the motor a little to see if it responds to my input cooperitively...... then I ride off. I leave the choke out while riding several feet to the first stop sign, a few more feet to the second stop sign, then I push the choke lever fully in upon shifting into second gear mere moments after leaving my driveway. I shift in as tall a gear as practical for the speed, and avoid from winding the engine out until the engine is warmed and oil is circulating.

Habits..... they're hard to break.
:-D

[ This message was edited by: FattRat on 2005-12-15 07:49 ]
 
#23 ·
Another interesting thread. MSF does some things very well, but some things quite poorly. On the poor side is an institutional insistence on following their procedure in every case. However, not everything they teach should be written in stone. This switch issue is indicative. Common sense should prevail at times. Given that you are going to remove the ignition key, then it would make sense to stop the engine using it. The kill switch simply breaks the ignition circuit. It will do no harm, nor is it either right nor wrong to use the kill switch, but you are still going to have to remove the key.
Look, do you brush your teeth beginning on the left side or the right side? Would you choose one or the other simply because your dentist insisted that his method is the only possible way of doing it?
 
#24 ·
If you want to leave it in gear and don't want to do the find neutral, turn off engine, pull clutch, drop into first again routine, why not just kick the side stand down while you are still in gear with the engine running? Presto, engine is off...although this may not solve your problem of walking away with the ignition still on :???:

I never use the kill switch because Triumph has said not to on both of the Triumphs that I have owned - Sprint RS & Thruxton. I used it all the time on my old Suzuki. I don't know what harm it could do to use it, but if they advise against it, why take the chance? :huh:

Steve :-g
 
#25 ·
I read somewhere on here that the reason Triumph wants us to turn off with the key switch is that it doesn't shut the computer down properly. Kinda like unplugging your home pc by pulling the cord out of the wall. I've also heard where some people had there bikes taken in for remapping, then later down the road they used the emergency kill switch and lost the updated mapping. So, better safe than sorry I use the key switch...
 
#26 ·
Zighawk,

If you want to kill the bike in gear, you can always leave it in first and put the kickstand down. That doesn't fix your problem with leaving the key though.

Personally, I use the key because it makes sense to me. That is the same way I shut down my car. On a previous bike I had (kick start only) I nearly killed myself trying to start it before I realized I had forgotten to turn the kill switch on. :brk: I got out of that habit really fast!

OT: Nice to hear from you active duty guys. Keep on keeping the world safe for us! :chug:
 
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