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Synthetic oil in a triple?

16K views 90 replies 32 participants last post by  loxx101 
#1 ·
Since the bikes use a dry clutch, can I run sythetic oil (an automotive synthetic like Mobil 1) in the crankcase for longer life? I know synthetic would be too slippery for bikes with wet clutches.
 
#2 ·
You can, yes. However, if you haven't had the gaskets off for a while they will probably leak due to the detergent in the oil breaking up the residue from the old oil. This got synthetic oil a bad name because people had badly maintained bikes...

Many people will dispute this but at the end of the day, synthetic literally means it's the pure form of dinosaur oil built in a lab rather than mined. It basically doesn't have the rubbish in it. There are some arguments about Zinc content and stuff with old bikes but I can't personally find any evidence to support this being an actual fact.
 
#34 ·
LOXX,

You are 100% absolutely correct about Syn being made from Dyno as the feed stock......unless the feed stock used to make the Syn was vegetable oil or natural gas or gasoline. Syn is made from any "hydrocarbon". I suspect that even cane sugar would work. The Germans made gasoline and oils of all types and kerosine from natural gas and coal gas. Krauts(I am one) have no oil wells worth mentioning yet they fought the heck out of WWII.

But the favorite feed stock is Dyno only cause that is plentiful and I have heard that used motor oil is also used but they don't brag on that. I don't have links and quotes to back this up but I am sure enuff to carry the tale.

Thanks,

John
 
#5 ·
"Mobil 1" comes in a lot of different flavours.Some are low-zinc, low-viscosity passenger car oils.
There are 2 Mobil 1 motorcycle oils that I know of.
Mobil 1 V-TWIN 20W50 has enough zinc (ZDDP) to protect your cams and tappets (more than most oils).You will need more cam protection than the average Triumph twin.

If you get oil leakage,you have a gasket problem and any oil would leak.
 
#6 · (Edited)
Broadly speaking motorcycle oil comes in Jaso ratings, MA & MB
There are also sub ratings of MA & MB :http://www.oilspecifications.org/articles/JASO_MA_JASO_MB.php

As long as you have a dry clutch either type is fine.
If you develop oil leaks then that just an indication it's time to pull things apart and fit new gaskets anyway, most modern machines run synthetics with nothing but a silicone sealer between the major gasket faces and have no problem.
The seals are no problem, they are the same material as the new stuff.
I run all three of my bikes on full synthetics, the two four strokes with high zinc type.
 
#7 ·
My experience with Mobil 1 car oil in my T120 is.Piston siezure which i fixed.followed by main bearing failure of the roller bearing which looked like the rollers had not been turning due to the low friction of the oil.Never had a problem before or since.The only alteration was using Mobil 1 and the problems started at 100 miles.Bear in mind my 34 years experience with running T120s.I use a motorcycle specific synth now or mineral 20/50 and get no problems at all.When i put synth in,i get gasket leaks,then,change the oil to mineral and the leaks are cured.right now,i have Duckhams Q20/50 and an oil tight motor.Next change will see a synth as it helps oil the chain and lower frame.I quite like the oil trail from the pushrod tubes as it makes it look like its bleeding.If i were choosing a synth,the last one i would put in is car Mobil 1 0/40....Mobil 1 20/50 is excellent however
 
#9 ·
It was 0/40 car oil.I find its great in my car engine.Only thing i can think is the oil was so slippery,the rollers did not turn.There was no damage anywhere else but the roller bearing.All ball bearing and plain bearings were un marked.
The biggest advantage of the other synths i have used is the easy starting and nice tickover
 
#10 ·
Thing is, bearings aren't designed with a specific oil in mind like that. The bearings we use on our bikes will be used in masses of applications. I'd be stunned if it was due to the oil.

Do you still have the bearing? If so, whack some pics of the outer race and the rollers!

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Motorcycle.com Free App
 
#11 ·
Threw the bearing away.The rollers looked perfect but the outer race was looking like someone had run an angle grinder around it.Nice even scoring looking like the rollers had been making metal to metal contact.Possibly,the oil was too thin so no wedge of oil was pushed along in front of the rollers.
 
#18 ·
Honestly, as I said before, synthetic oil is literally lab built, not mined. There is no logical reason it wouldn't work. Additives may well make a difference but the base oil is JUST better.

People never have problems with synthetic after a rebuild or in new engines. If you use the correct grade, it's just cleaner oil, that's all. It does have detergents added too which just keeps it cleaner. No more sludge trap blocking up! Keeps all oilways clear etc. This is the thing, it'll best to start using synthetic after a rebuild ideally as it'll break up all the rubbish in your system already. People generally get problems from using synthetic because they don't understand what it is or how it works.

It's worth noting as well that UK sold Synthetic is genuine lab built. USA made MIGHT be lab built but it could easily be filtered stuff from a mine. They do filter it more than older oils so it's still the best you can get. European law is stricter on how the branding of oils work. Probably makes no difference to be fair, I imagine the difference is negligible. :)
 
#20 ·
People never have problems with synthetic after a rebuild or in new engines. If you use the correct grade, it's just cleaner oil, that's all. It does have detergents added too which just keeps it cleaner. No more sludge trap blocking up! Keeps all oilways clear etc. This is the thing, it'll best to start using synthetic after a rebuild ideally as it'll break up all the rubbish in your system already. People generally get problems from using synthetic because they don't understand what it is or how it works.
Mineral oils have also had detergents added since the 1960s. IMHO, modern monograde mineral oil is ideal for classic engines. Check out the following link to Miller Classic oils: http://www.millersoils.co.uk/automotive/classic-engine-oil.asp

 
#19 ·
on the Alfa Romeo bulletin board, people tell stories of trying synthetic, the most complaints are extreme leaks with synthetic. all alfa engines leak a little, but synthetic makes them leak more. I use 20w50 castrol gtx in mine and it wasnt leaking very much. I just rebuilt the engine completely, and at 87 thousand miles, there was no measurable wear on the crank.
I use the recomended synthetic for my bonnieville, and there has been no problem for 28 thousand miles.
cliff
 
#21 ·
But monograde is used literally for one temperature. It's best to use a multigrade suited for your country/area. Most of the time the manufacturer will specify a grade that'll probably be the same for all/most countries anyway as the difference wouldn't be that vast I don't reckon.

Synthetics are cleaner so leave less deposits and the detergents are better. That's why using synthetic wouid leak more. It doesn't have crap in it that's going to clog the holes so it never does.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Synthetic oil is fine in motorcycles, however automotive synthetics aren't. DO NOT USE AUTOMOBILE OIL IN A MOTORCYCLE. Car oils contain anti friction additives that will kill motorcycle clutches and bearings. Some of you posters seem to have found out this the hard way. The auto oil is too thin for motorcycle use,too. They thin down the oil and change clearances and materials so the oil will work in them. The whole point is to get better mileage buy reducing internal drag.
Synthetic motorcycle oil does contain many of the same additives that car oils do, like zinc, molybdenum disulphide and a bunch of others.
If you want to run Mobil 1 Synthetic in your T160, I'd recommend their 20W-50 V-Twin stuff. It's made for air cooled motorcycles. I use it in my Royal Enfield.
If you really want to know a lot about motorcycle oils, Amsoil did a comparison test on a bunch of oils, and showed the contents of each brand and wear comparisons on each. It's a complete detailing of oils and a good thing to have in the memory box. Unfortunately, I can't find my link to it, but I should think a search for Amsoil oil Comparisons or Tests should bring it up.
Bare
 
#44 ·
motorcycle specific oil

First, Barenekd is right.

Second, check your manual - first and foremost.

The simple answer to this is that 4-stroke motorcycle specific oil, and car oil, are definitely different (critically, different)

4 Stroke bike oil is designed to provide the proper frictional characteristics necessary for wet-clutch engine/transmission systems.

If you have a dry clutch, then check your owner's manual.

I run Mobil 1 racing 4T in my tiger but i am not necessarily partial to it. I am sure there are cheaper oils that are just as good.

Here is the link to the Amsoil test but I'd take it with a grain of salt. This is an oil manufacturer, supposedly, doing an unbiased test on...motorycle oil and what do you know, they come out on top.
http://www.amsoil.com/graphs/motooils2005/10W40_weartest_640.jpg

But I give them credit for showing Mobil 1 coming in as a tie.
 
#25 ·
I've seen that test and it is excellent.
Norton recommended 20W-50 for one year and then went back to straight 50W. I used Kendall in those days.
I've used a proprietary oil called LE in my Trophy 1200 and Daytona 1200 and had no trouble. I used the proper viscosity too.
 
#28 ·
I've got a 2010 tiger 1050 that came brand new from e dealership with Mobil 1 10W40 4T racing oil. 16K miles later that's all the bike has ever had in it. Absolutely no issues to date. As for weight, consider the thicker the oil the more difficult it is for that oil to get into all the little nooks and crannies inside the engine. My 2 pennies worth
 
#27 ·
I've used nothing but synthetic in my `09 Street 3R, first Mobil 1 and Amsoil. No leaks but it used a little oil with both. Since then I've been using Motul 5100 with no significant decrease in oil level and it seems to stay clean. I'm very pleased with it. I get it from Motorcycle Superstore.
 
#29 ·
oil-oil-oil, first real synthetics are manufactured from esters etc, most synthetics since castrol won the right to call highly refined dino synthetic in the USA is not. amsoil motorcycle oils are a real synthetic, and is excellent, fine for wet clutches as well as roller bearings, the bull harley cried before they endorced their overpriced fake synthetic screamin chicken oi,l a little leakage is less important than the best lubricants, especially hot running air-cooled bikes. those running straight outdated heavy dino oil are starving their engines of oil when cold. lots of info out there just grab a beer, search and read!!!
 
#33 ·
Rotella T oil for my 2005 Thruxton and also T6 Synthetic

Rotella T oil for my 2005 Thruxton and also T6 Synthetic. Both cheaper in price than the crazy expensive other brands like Mobil 1.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_Rotella_T



Motorcycle usage

Though marketed as an engine oil for diesel trucks, Rotella oil has found popularity with motorcyclists as well. The lack of "friction modifiers" in Rotella means they do not interfere with wet clutch operations. (This is called a "shared sump" design, which is unlike automobiles which maintain separate oil reservoirs - one for the engine and one for the transmission). Used oil analysis (UOA) reports on BobIsTheOilGuy.com have shown wear metals levels comparable to oils marketed as motorcycle-specific.

JASO-MA
JASO is an acronym that stands for "The Japanese Automotive Standards Organization." Among other things, they set standards for oil to be used in motorcycles.
Shell Rotella T 15W-40 conventional oil does not list on its packaging JASO MA as one of the specifications it meets. Note that the 10W-30 conventional oil does not list JASO-MA.
The newer fully synthetic T6 5W-40 oil lists JASO-MA compliance on its packaging and on the Rotella website.
 
#35 · (Edited)
Rotella T oil for my 2005 Thruxton and also T6 Synthetic. Both cheaper in price than the crazy expensive other brands like Mobil 1.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_Rotella_T

Motorcycle usage

Though marketed as an engine oil for diesel trucks, Rotella oil has found popularity with motorcyclists as well. The lack of "friction modifiers" in Rotella means they do not interfere with wet clutch operations. (This is called a "shared sump" design, which is unlike automobiles which maintain separate oil reservoirs - one for the engine and one for the transmission). Used oil analysis (UOA) reports on BobIsTheOilGuy.com have shown wear metals levels comparable to oils marketed as motorcycle-specific.

JASO-MA
JASO is an acronym that stands for "The Japanese Automotive Standards Organization." Among other things, they set standards for oil to be used in motorcycles.
Shell Rotella T 15W-40 conventional oil does not list on its packaging JASO MA as one of the specifications it meets. Note that the 10W-30 conventional oil does not list JASO-MA.
The newer fully synthetic T6 5W-40 oil lists JASO-MA compliance on its packaging and on the Rotella website.
+1 on using Rotella T6. In the past, I used Mobil 4T in my '00 Triumph Sprint ST and logged over 30k miles without any leakage, clutch slippage, oil consumption, or mechanical problems. Marketed by Mobil for high performance motorcycles, supposedly it's the same as the more expensive "Triumph Racing Oil" hawked in Triumph dealerships. For modern air-cooled bikes such as Harleys and Buells, Mobil recommends their V-Twin synthetic, which should be suitable for current air-cooled Triumph twins as well.

Back to Rotella T6. I just bought a low mileage (7k miles) '07 Sprint ST 1050 and immediately filled her with Rotella T6 based on a friend's recommendation. Skeptical at first, and concerned about the lower 5W viscosity, I was swayed when told he'd logged over 38k miles on his Rotella-fed Sprint RS without a single problem - no clutch slippage, no oil consumption, no oil leakage, no mechanical issues of any type, nada. Says the old bike runs as good as the day he bought it. Pretty compelling Rotella argument.
 
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